Seems like we are about to experience the mother of all gaslights in response to the Putin bounties.

My guess: Bill Barr is going to launch an "investigation" into the "leaker" who gave the story to the NY Times which is also going to somehow become magically connected to Obamagate

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Still on Russia, are you? Some people never learn.

-------------------------
I :heart; Q

so are you trying to say that you're OK with the Russians paying bounties to kill American soldiers?

-------------------------
"I remember South Africa in the late 70's, sleeping on the beach at J-bay, smoking ganja with the blacks. On weekends we'd go to the pub in East London to drink beer and fight with the Afrikaners. They liked to fight, I liked to fight. It was a good time"

Good to know who's side you're on, Paul.

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

Data intercepts showed GRU-to-Taliban $ transfers & a key intermediary fled to Russia, bolstering earlier detainee accounts about a Russian bounty op. Trump WH omitted in its briefing to GOP lawmakers as it downplayed intel as murky/contested.

Well said, Dr. Dan Barkhuff, well said...




-------------------------
If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV

-------------------------
I was right.

I wonder what the going rate is to take out a US soldier in Afghanistan?

-------------------------
“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

RT - In the late '60s the North Vietnamese put a bounty of $30,000 USD on GySgt Carlos Hathcock. He was a USMC sniper who gave them hell and they wanted him gone. He and his spotter killed every counter sniper team sent against him.

-------------------------
If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV


Edited: 06/30/2020 at 09:23 AM by Bamboo

according to obama; remember him? that is silly he said to Romney guess you didnt get the memo. Russia was Hillarys friend remember the red button? you goons have selectve memory and reflexive tendencies to be hypocritical. good luck with your russia probe, happy digits can give you some really good inside info, he is connected.

I think Iran is offering a reward for the arrest of trump and some his accomplices.

-------------------------
“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

Fucking MORONS!

Pentagon says 'no corroborating evidence' of Russian bounties on US troops as media claims increase:

http://americanmilitarynews.co...ign=alt&utm_source=amn

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

Edited: 06/30/2020 at 09:48 AM by Fish Killer

"The Department of Defense continues to evaluate intelligence that Russian GRU operatives were engaged in malign activity against United States and coalition forces in Afghanistan. To date, DOD has no corroborating evidence to validate the recent allegations found in open-source reports," chief Pentagon spokesman Jonathan Hoffman said in a statement.

"Regardless, we always take the safety and security of our forces in Afghanistan - and around the world - most seriously and therefore continuously adopt measures to prevent harm from potential threats," he continued.

Trump claims he was never briefed on the reports (lie). Calls it a hoax (lie).

The moral of the story. He was briefed on this for a long time now. He never questioned Putin and rather gave him praise and requested he attended G7 and is also trying to pull troops out of Germany, both gifts to Putin.

"Pentagon says 'no corroborating evidence' of Russian bounties on US troops as media claims increase"


-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

As you know, facts are irrelevant to these bumbling idiots. Most of these dimwits still believe that Trump colluded with Russia even though an investigation by their super hero, Mueller, found nothing after 3 years, and every news organization on the planet was looking for it. Go look up the "Trump is going down" thread to remind yourself of how profoundly dumb some of these people are.

-------------------------
I :heart; Q

LOL nice clownin

Regardless of when he first learned of the Russian Bounty scandal, the story broke almost a week ago. At no time since has Trump offered a word or action on behalf of US troops put at risk by our Russian enemies.

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Reports of Bolton briefing the prez in early 2019...

So... Bolton knew too...

-------------------------
GOP:

Gaslight
Obstruct
Project

Sooooo....Trump is now required to tell you what he's up to!

Got it!

MORON!

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

Even if you bought the "we didn't tell the president" nonsense, the entire country has know about Putin's cash-for-dead-US-soldiers program for 2 weeks now, and Trump and the GOP have done NOTHING. Trump won't say one word against Putin, even for putting a bounty on Americans.

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Gentlemen. This can all be cleared up by asking Putin if he did this. Same as last time. The Helsinki two step, or sidestep, depending on how you view commander bone spurs.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

"We should partner with Putin's intelligence teams." -Trump

LOL now Pattycakez is quoting Fish Killer. It's all he has left... two dotards in a pod.



-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

https://www.militarytimes.com/...anistan-officials-say/

The White House knew something was up.
Trump was too lazy to read, too dense to understand, or to beholding to Putin to want to do anything.
Any one of those is bad.

-------------------------
If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV


Edited: 06/30/2020 at 01:39 PM by Bamboo

tRump has spoken to Putin 5 times since the end of March.

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

I'm sure it has nothing to do with billions in loans and other forms of blackmail.

fakefishkller free July!

Just do it!



-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

Send this draft dodging coward back to his golf course. I think that already happened.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nytBEWbwOkw


A SEAL tells tRump what to do

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Trumpsters will support him even if he gases his own supporters.

Baghdad Bob had nothing on Kayleigh McEnany

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

"Trump doesn't care what happens to these guys [American soldiers]," said Trump's former White House Chief of Staff and retired U.S. Marine Corps general John Kelly

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Of course he doesn't. All he cares about is himself. Putin has something on him so he pays the beast to survive. I'm assuming Putin has something on him with Epstein.

Edited: 06/30/2020 at 04:42 PM by HAPDigital

The Russians clearly have him in the thumbscrews.

Pugs voted in the actual Manchurian Candidate.

I'm sure it was easy to get Donnie's balls in a vice- he's such a dumbass.. Russian agents could think circles around him.

He's an expert at losing money- they probably sucked him into laundering shit tons of cash through his properties and casino.

They've probably got criminal shit on him and his kids that would send them all to prison for 30 years.

That's why we gotta see those tax returns.


And we know it's true that he's in bed with Russia. Why? Because TWrong says he's not- that's really all you need to know!

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

Edited: 06/30/2020 at 05:50 PM by fishkller

http://www.politico.com/news/2...a-uproar-trump-345584

They are probing us from every angle.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

Well let's hope those white "tic-tac" UFO's don't turn out to be some kind of secret Russian military drone.. because otherwise, we're F'ed

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

fakefishkller free July!

Just do it!

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

This is from the piece that JD cited: " An exaggerated sense of self-importance. An unwarranted belief in your own superiority. A preoccupation with fantasies of your own success, power and brilliance. A craving for constant admiration. A consuming sense of entitlement. An expectation of special favors and unquestioning compliance.
A penchant for exploiting or disparaging others. A total inability to recognize the needs of anyone else. An incapacity to see those you meet as separate human beings. An unreasoning fury at people you perceive as thwarting your wishes or desires. A tendency to act on impulse. A superficial charm deployed to disguise a gift for manipulation.
A need to always be right. A refusal to acknowledge error. An inability to tolerate criticism or critics. A compulsion to conform your ever - shifting sense of "reality" to satisfy your inner requirements. A tendency to lie so frequently and routinely that objective truth loses all meaning.
A belief that you are above the rules. An array of inconsistent statements and behaviors driven by your needs in the moment. An inability to assess the consequences of your actions in new or complex situations."


That seems strikingly on point.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

Trump supposedly has known about this for almost a week now. No action on Russia. Hmmmm

fakefishkller free July!

Just do it!

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

It will be interesting to eventually find out what the Russians have on Donny Dotard.

I'm going with money laundering..

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

fakefishkller free July!

Just do it!

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

Sure puts the Pugs in a pickle.

Biden will run to the right of trump on Russia and make them look like bitches if they look the other way.



-------------------------
“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

you pugs should just write-in PUTIN lol traitors..

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

LOL Damn

I mean why not? Quit pussy-footing around dotards..

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

The Brevard Commissioner of Elections has said that any vote for Putin will be automatically corrected to Trump.

"We know what y'all meant!"

Edited: 07/01/2020 at 12:15 PM by Greensleeves

So either:

a) Trump was briefed and is still lying

or

b) The briefer chose not to brief Trump on this specific item because he knew Trump is Putin's bitch and he wouldn't want to hear this information

Either way, this ( many expletives) does not belong anywhere near the White House.

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Y E P

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

Rep. Mike McCaul (R-Tex.), the top Republican on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, confirmed after a White House briefing that, "There was intelligence reported on the allegation that the Russians were offering a bounty to the Taliban to kill Americans." He added that there was a "massive scrub within the intelligence community to try to find out the veracity of this reporting." He has also suggested that it is serious enough that, if accurate, it would warrant "swift and serious action" against Russia.

Curious if we ever paid Taliban to kill Russians during the 80's? The answer is yes. This is what spies do. This is a non-story.

Correct. But progs will feign outrage over anything Trump. Most of us tune them out anymore.

-------------------------
I :heart; Q

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone

-------------------------
“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

It's a non story if you're a traitorous bitch.

Party line? You aholes like that quid pro quo bs now dont you?

Prove it. Post some legit evidence that says the US paid the Taliban to assassinate Russians.

So becaUSE YOU, a tRump dick sucker, say we did it, it now justifies that its OK.

Traitors raise their heads every day.

If tRump was not the potus, we would be retaliating in several ways right now. It is so very painfully obvious that tRump and his henchmen owe Putin.

Judgement day is coming for traitors. Adding you to the list.





-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

One can only hope. I won't be in favor of executing you guys, though. I'd only ship you off to the foreign hell holes that you want to model this country after, Venezuela, Cuba, California and places like that.

-------------------------
I :heart; Q

Oh no!! your on the list.

Probably the real take away from this is that the Russians have utter contempt for trump and see him as a patsy. That may be because they recognize a loud mouth putana when they see one, or they have something on him such that he wouldn't dare confront them on anything. Either way, for those of you who harbor nationalist sentiments, your outrage is justified.



-------------------------
“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

Talk about bowing down and "washing feet" LOL

Tpap I think your boy needs some more soap and a brush to get under those dirty toenails

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

In addition to being on your traitor list, will this reflect poorly on my permanent record?

So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Hey lets have a Congressional hearing. By now the old house, which did nothing for Americans, would have had scheduled some hearings. Wear is that pu$$y Jim Jordan now? Benghazi solved yet?

and look at the apologist GOP loads. Members of the confederacy, the KGB and the Taliban anymore, and now figuring out how they can separate twitler and epstein. they've aligned themselves with $hit.

Lincoln Project! Yes jdb their silence shows, to quote Mr Barhuff, their spineless cowardlike nature.

"SEARCHING FOR LEAKERS ... THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION has opened an internal investigation to try to uncover who leaked intelligence about Russians paying the Taliban bounties to kill American soldiers."

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

**psst!** Hey tRump! The leakers are coming from inside your own admin!

-------------------------
GOP:

Gaslight
Obstruct
Project

Ted Lieu
@tedlieu

US House candidate, CA-33

"The @WhiteHouse & @GOP are more concerned about who told the American people that Russia paid bounties to Taliban to kill US troops, than about actually responding to Russia.

The fact that
@realDonaldTrump
still hasn't condemned Vladimir Putin is treasonous behavior."

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

The leaker probably saw that trump did nothing and would never do anything so he leaked it. It's treason to leak top secret classified information from the daily briefing that trump never reads. This leaker is leaking because trump has kept his inaction and cowardice secret. The leaker will be found and punished. I personally would pardon him or maybe drop the prosecution against him so he wouldn't even need a pardon.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

Let them all congregate and hear Trump whine. Keep your eyes on the monuments and not Russians.

Squirrel!



-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

There is no moral high ground on this one. He didn't fein concern and that is what it's all about. Terrible actor or is he?

The difference is that we now see the behavior that was always there and we are appalled because it indicts us. Our current president threw the curtains open to let all of the useful idiots see the blood and circus that has been concealed behind the velvet curtain. Daring anyone to claim the moral high ground knowing that no one can. He made it clear that he could shoot someone on 5th Ave and no one could or would do anything about it. So, he does that figuratively every day. He is clearly a manifestation of who we are. Not a representation of who we can be.

It is only when we see ourselves for what we really are that we are able to change ourselves into who we want to be.

-------------------------
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

"but the leakers....."

Our current president threw the curtains open to let all of the useful idiots see the blood and circus that has been concealed behind the velvet curtain.

Obama knew Russia was paying hit money on US soldiers and did nothing about it?

Sorry, but Trump isn't the same, the only curtain he held back was the one to the mental ward for the dumb-asses who voted for him.

-------------------------
I was right.

Hating Trump will not solve the systemic problem. It will only blind you with rage!

-------------------------
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

Well, that was dumb. lol

Removing Trump will most certainly help the problem.

Birth control is no longer covered.

... and this is just the beginning. What else will Trump accomplish in another four years?



-------------------------
I was right.

Yes, trump must be voted out.


Biden's conversation with Sanders alleviates the concern that he will move even further right.




-------------------------
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

Secretary of Defense Mark Esper confirmed that he had been briefed on information regarding Russian payments to the Taliban, seemingly acknowledging that it is not a "hoax," as tRump has claimed.

-------------------------
So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

That's not how informing the President works on these issues....,

MORON!

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

^ Traitor

Yes in fact your prog commie demoshit ass is in fact a traitor!

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

^ no college degree

ehh ok ?

-------------------------


Zzzzzzz.. Zzzzzzz.. Braaaaaapp!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

Dab working pretty hard to say everyone is guilty of the same crimes. I smell an agenda. A goal of creating a false equivalence. No difference between a good president and a really bad one and we are all to blame. This is the push to make every one guilty and every action futile to prevent it.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

from Just Security:

by Ryan Goodman
July 8, 2020


"Why would the Russian government think it could get away with paying bounties to the Taliban to kill American soldiers? One answer to that question may be the extraordinary response that Moscow received when the Trump administration learned of a precursor to the bounty operation. From mid-2017 and into 2018, Pentagon officials became increasingly confident in intelligence reports that the Kremlin was arming the Taliban, which posed a significant threat to American and coalition forces on the ground in Afghanistan.

President Trump's actions in the face of the Russia-Taliban arms program likely signaled a weak US resolve in the eyes of Putin and Russian military intelligence.

Three dimensions of Trump's response are described in detail in this article, based on interviews with several former Trump administration officials who spoke to Just Security on the record.

First, President Trump decided not to confront Putin about supplying arms to the terrorist group. Second, during the very times in which U.S. military officials publicly raised concerns about the program's threat to US forces, Trump undercut them. He embraced Putin, overtly and repeatedly, including at the historic summit in Helsinki. Third, behind the scenes, Trump directed the CIA to share intelligence information on counterterrorism with the Kremlin despite no discernible reward, former intelligence officials who served in the Trump administration told Just Security.

Most of these officials emphasized, as a caution, the significant qualitative difference between arming the Taliban and paying bounties to kill American service members - a massive escalation. Unlike bounties, the Russian-Taliban arms program could also be potentially explained, or plausibly denied, by Moscow as an effort to assist the Taliban's fight against the common enemy of ISIS. That said, the arms also reportedly became increasingly sophisticated in what appears to provide the Taliban an edge against NATO and Afghan government forces.

The failure to push back on the weapons program signaled to Putin that he could press further, said Michael Carpenter, Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense with responsibility for Russia in the Obama administration. "When Western powers fail to push back, the Kremlin keeps prodding and probing - until it meets resistance, or until the costs for President Putin and his regime exceed the perceived benefits," Carpenter wrote in Just Security on Friday.

What we now know is that President Trump not only failed to push back against Russia's arming the terrorist group. That extraordinary act of omission was coupled with the president's effort to push the CIA to cooperate with Russia by providing U.S. intelligence to the Kremlin on counterterrorism operations despite getting nothing in return, according to former officials.

A. Top Military Officials Sounds the Alarm

President Trump has denied being informed of U.S. intelligence reports on the Russian bounty operation, but the same can't be so easily claimed about the Russian weapons to the Taliban. Over the course of 2017 and 2018, senior military officials began speaking openly, in media interviews and before Congress, about their increasing confidence in the intelligence picture of the Russian arms and the significant concerns it raised for U.S. and Coalition troops.

The following Timeline shows the series of public statements by senior military officials about the Kremlin's provision of weapons to the Taliban.

Timeline
Feb. 9, 2017: Gen. John Nicholson, Commander, U.S. Forces Afghanistan and NATO's Resolute Support Mission, in testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee made headlines by drawing attention to Russian efforts to support the Taliban; over the following months, senior military officials would specifically identify the problem of Russian provision of weapons to the Taliban

Note on President Trump: On Feb. 16, 2017 President Trump says in a press conference, "by the way, it would be great if we could get along with Russia;" "If we could get along with Russia, that's a positive thing. We have a very talented man, Rex Tillerson, who is going to be meeting with them shortly. And I told him, I said, I know politically it's probably not good for me;" "if we could get along, it would be a positive thing, not a negative thing."

March 23, 2017: Gen. Curtis M. Scaparrotti, Commander, U.S. European Command and Supreme Allied Commander, Europe in testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee raises the Russian arms issue

March 29, 2017: Gen. Joseph L. Votel, Commander, U.S. Central Command in testimony before the House Armed Services Committee raises the Russian arms issue

April 24, 2017: Defense Secretary Jim Mattis and Gen. John Nicholson, Commander, Resolute Support and U.S. Forces Afghanistan, in a press conference held in Afghanistan raise the Russian arms issue

Note on President Trump: On May 10, 2017, Trump meets with Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov and Ambassador Sergey Kislyak in the Oval Office, where the President reportedly passes highly classified information to the two Russian officials

Note on President Trump: On May 25, 2017, in Europe, Trump chastises NATO leaders for their "chronic underpayments" to the alliance and fails to reaffirm U.S. commitment to Article 5 of the Atlantic Charter for collective self-defense in a speech; the omission surprises Defense Secretary Jim Mattis, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, and National Security Advisor McMaster, who endeavored to include language supporting Article 5 in Trump's remarks prior to the summit, Politico reports

Note on President Trump: On July 9, 2017: Upon returning from his first face-to-face meeting with Putin at the G-20 summit in Hamburg, Germany, Trump tweets, "Now it is time to move forward in working constructively with Russia!"

Note on President Trump: July 19, 2017: US officials announce that Trump has decided to end a program to arm Syrian rebels. An anonymous current official tells the Washington Post, "This is a momentous decision. ... Putin won in Syria." A former White House official tells the Post, "People began thinking about ending the program, but it was not something you'd do for free." "To give [the program] away without getting anything in return would be foolish." These statements are even more relevant in consideration of Russia's arming of the Taliban at the time.

Sept. 28, 2017: Sec. Mattis in a joint press conference with Afghanistan President Ashraf Ghani and NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg raises the Russian arms issue

Note on President Trump: On Jan. 29, 2018: The White House announces it will not impose new sanctions on Russia

March 23, 2018: Gen. John Nicholson, Commander, Resolute Support and U.S. Forces Afghanistan in an interview with the BBC raises the Russian arms issue

Note on President Trump: On July 5, 2018: President Trump says at a political rally, "I might even end up having a good relationship, but they're going, 'Will President Trump be prepared? You know, President Putin is KGB and this and that.' You know what? Putin's fine. He's fine."

Note on President Trump: On July 16, 2018, in a very friendly summit between the two leaders at Helsinki, President Trump publicly sides with President Putin over the U.S. intelligence community on the Russian interference in the 2016 presidential elections

On Sept. 1, 2018, Gen. Nicholson told the Voice of America, "We know that Russia is attempting to undercut our military gains and years of military progress in Afghanistan, and make partners question Afghanistan's stability." A few days later, he steps down, as scheduled, after serving in the position for over two years. Mattis resigns that December over sharp policy differences with the president.

B. President Trump's Noticeable Silence

Absent from those public statements by top military officials were similar public statements or public protestations by President Trump, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, or Mattis's successors. "Nicholson's 2018 interview was a rare public protest by a U.S. official. Trump didn't press the Russians to stop, and so they continued," wrote the Washington Post's David Ignatius last week.

Peter Bergen observed a similar discrepancy between Nicholson's BBC interview and President Trump's disposition toward Putin, in Bergen's 2019 book, Trump and His Generals: The Cost of Chaos.

If anything, there was reason for administration officials to intensify their public opposition to Russian military support for the Taliban, not quiet themselves. That's in part because the Kremlin's support became more sophisticated and a greater threat to US, NATO, and Afghan forces, Carpenter told me. In an email, he said:

The type of equipment the Russians transferred to the Taliban also shows how the Kremlin was becoming increasingly confrontational over time. At first, the Russians were mostly providing excess AK-47s, weapons that are found in almost every major global conflict. More recently, however, they also started transferring night-vision equipment, which is both in shorter supply in Russia but also specifically intended to equalize the gap between NATO forces and the Taliban. Throughout the conflict in Afghanistan, U.S. special forces have always "owned the night." The Russians wanted to change that to the detriment of the U.S. and its NATO allies.

At a press conference this past Wednesday, July 1, Pompeo suggested that he repeatedly confronted his Russian counterparts about the arms program, even though the reporter had not asked about that program. The reporter posed a question about the bounties:

On this bounty issue, you had some conversations with senior Russian officials after your aides were told about evidence of the Russian bounties. Did you use those opportunities to tell Moscow not to endanger U.S. troops in that manner?

In his response, Pompeo raised the arms program:

We took this seriously; we handle it appropriately. The Russians have been selling small arms that have put Americans at risk there for 10 years. We have objected to it. To your point, when I meet with my Russian counterparts, I talk with them about this each time: "Stop this." ... So yes, maybe not every time, but with great frequency, when I speak to my Russian counterparts we talk about Afghanistan. We talk about the fact that we don't want them engaged in this.

In his reply, Pompeo had made one of the strongest statements to date of the administration's confidence in the intelligence assessment of the Russian-Taliban arms program and its threat to US forces. (See also Pompeo's reiterating those claims later the same day in a Fox News interview.)

But Pompeo's claim to have "handle[d] it appropriately" and to have raised the arms supplies with his Russian counterparts, presumably including Foreign Minister Lavrov, is dubious.

"To my knowledge, this was never raised with Putin by Trump or any other senior officials, nor am I aware of any specific high-level pushes for this to be raised with senior Russian officials," a former senior Trump administration official told Just Security.

Nonetheless, it can't be completely ruled out that Pompeo raised the issue, for example, in one-on-one meetings. But how much would that matter without President Trump's taking action including in his public statements about Russia and engagements with Putin?

In speaking about both the Kremlin's arms and bounty programs, Brett McGurk, who served as Special Presidential Envoy until December 2018, told me, "Both should have been flagged and raised in Trump's frequent engagements with Putin. It's even worse if Pompeo was raising the arming issue with Lavrov (as he claims) or Khalilzad with his counterpart, but Trump never raised the issue with Putin. That makes whatever Pompeo may have said irrelevant, as the Russians dismiss anything Americans officials say if not backed from the top."

I asked Rolf Mowatt-Larssen, a former senior CIA official with expertise on Russia and counterterrorism, how the President's inaction in this policy space would affect any similar efforts on the part of senior intelligence officials to raise concerns with their Russian counterparts. "Given Trump's permissive relationship with Putin, and his generally skeptical attitude concerning US intelligence, Russian special services would feel more inclined to ignore any US demands for action if they doubted the president's resolve to back up the US intelligence community," Mowatt-Larssen told me.

C. Trump Pushes CIA to Share Intelligence with Russia

At the same time that senior US military officials were publicly expressing concerns that Russia was arming the Taliban's terrorist activities that threatened U.S. personnel, President Trump was pushing the CIA to share counterterrorism intelligence information with the Kremlin.

In the first weeks of the administration, National Security Advisor Michael Flynn tried to push the Defense Department to engage in cooperation with Russia, but the Pentagon and Centcom opposed his efforts, the Daily Beast's Spencer Ackerman reported. He was not the first to consider such an idea. Secretary of State John Kerry floated the concept of cooperation with Russia against terrorist groups in Syrian during the final year of the Obama administration, but was rejected by Defense Secretary Ash Carter and other parts of the administration. Like Kerry, Flynn ran into a roadblock: a provision of the National Defense Authorization Act strictly prohibits "bilateral military-to-military cooperation" between the United States and Russia, unless the Secretary of Defense issues a waiver and notifies Congress. Mattis reportedly refused to issue a waiver.

[For more on that statute, see former Department of Defense Acting General Counsel Robert S. Taylor's analysis and my earlier coverage at Just Security in 2018.]

But there's no analogous statute barring cooperation by the CIA.

That's where the White House succeeded in pushing the CIA to cooperate with Russia despite analysts determining the Kremlin would provide nothing in return, two former CIA officials who served in the Trump administration told me.

"There was a consistent push for CT cooperation with Moscow, coming from the White House, despite near universal belief within the IC that this effort would be one sided and end up being a waste of time and energy," said Marc Polymeropoulos, who retired in mid-2019 from the Senior Intelligence Service at the CIA.

"To be fair, every administration wants a reset with Moscow, and thus the IC dutifully attempted to engage with the Russian government on CT matters," he added in discussing the Trump policy. "Bottom line, we tried, as this was the guidance from policy makers. There was no 'deep state push back,' there was no stalling, there was a concerted effort to work with the Russians."

Douglas London, a CIA Senior Operations Officer who retired at the end of 2018, told me that "despite increasing reflections of Russian material support to the Taliban raised publicly by Defense Secretary James Mattis in 2017 and throughout 2018 by General John Nicholson, President Trump pressured CIA to invest time and resources increasing counterterrorist cooperation with Russia."

Prior administrations had also considered counterterrorism cooperation with Russia but learned the lesson that it was a one-way street on "cooperation." In testimony before the Congressional Helsinki Commission, Carpenter gave the example of attempted cooperation around the Sochi Olympics. "We discovered that our chief interlocutor was not a counterterrorism expert but rather a counter-intelligence official, bluntly demonstrating Moscow's chief priority lay in collecting intelligence on foreigners rather than sharing information on terrorist threats," the former deputy assistant secretary of defense said.

Polymeropoulos who was personally involved in making a trip to Moscow in late 2017 to advance the cooperation policy told me of a similar conclusion to the effort. "As we anticipated, however, it was a sisyphean task. We ended up only giving information, and not receiving anything worthwhile. I cannot think of anything of value that the Russians provided us, that saved any US lives, or was worth even the time it took to pick up the phone to set up the meetings."

"It was always the same line from downtown, even when failure was so evident and so obvious - keep engaging on CT." Polymeropoulos said. "This myth that Russians could be a good CT partner - that former National Security Advisor Flynn first perpetuated and then became the cornerstone of this farcical engagement strategy - was by 2019 met with near total derision and eye rolling in the IC."

"The direction [from President Trump] came despite assessments that Russia was not being forthcoming," London said. "Failing to reciprocate U.S. willingness and share information on what ostensibly represented threats from common adversaries such as al-Qa'ida and ISIS, Russian counterparts used counterterrorism engagements to further counterintelligence."

Before entering the administration, Pompeo himself had expressed contempt for the idea of cooperating with the Russians on counterterrorism. Asked to comment on Secretary Kerry's proposal in October 2016, then-Congressman Pompeo was nothing short of scathing, "For the United States to share intelligence in a way that they hope we can keep sources and methods secure is foolish. ... a dumb idea ... such an awful idea ... I hope that the silliness of Secretary Kerry on this issue will never come to fruition. It would be bad ... for America."

Pompeo served as CIA Director during the program described by Polymeropoulos and London. He left the CIA for the State Department in late April 2018.

D. Protections of US Personnel on the Ground: Getting Priorities Straight

The heart of the criticism of President Trump's handling of Russian bounty intelligence reports has been his lack of action toward Moscow to safeguard American troops threatened by Russia's aggression. Trump's lack of response to the Russian arms to the Taliban may have helped pave the way to the increasingly audacious acts by Putin against U.S. forces. Was it a case of the President Trump making tradeoffs in his relationship with Putin?

"The operators on the ground are always victims of this strategic chess game," Polymeropoulos said.

Polymeropoulos advised putting it in the context of Pakistan's support for the Taliban and the failure of administrations' to push back adequately with Islamabad. "Pakistan is far more complicit, Russians did it but not to the level of the Pakistanis, until the bounty issue. The bounty issue takes this to another level perhaps putting Russia now in the category of Pakistan, as a state sponsor of terrorism, in my view."

Bipartisan legislation in the Senate, co-sponsored by Sen. Cory Gardner (R-CO) and Sen. Robert Menendez, (D-NJ) and passed by the Senate Foreign Relations Committee in December, would place pressure on the State Department to designate Russia a state sponsor of terrorism. Politico reported, in the wake of revelations about Russia's bounty operation, that Gardner has renewed his push for the legislation with Sen. Thom Tillis (R-NC) voicing support in recent days.

I also communicated with Ambassador Todd Buchwald who retired from the State Department in July 2017, after serving across five Republican and Democratic administrations. As the Special Coordinator for the Department's Office of Global Criminal Justice since 2015, one of Buchwald's areas of expertise is the International Criminal Court's investigation of US forces in Afghanistan.

Buchwald compared President Trump's response to the Russian arms and bounty programs to the administration's most recent actions toward the ICC. He provided a comment by email:

This episode just underscores how hard it is to figure out how the Administration decides what are and what are not our urgent national priorities - the situations in which it is appropriate for the President to invoke the extraordinary authorities that Congress long ago entrusted to Presidents upon a "declaration of national emergency." Look at the administration's reactions to two threats: the potential for an ICC case alleging U.S. detainee abuse in Afghanistan, and Russian support for the actual slaughter of U.S. service members there.

Just three weeks ago, the President asserted his "steadfast commitment to protecting American service members and defending our national sovereignty" as his basis for his Executive Order imposing sanctions against the International Criminal Court. There are lots of different views about the Court but in fact it has never - in its history - actually convicted, or even prosecuted, the acts of a service member of the standing military of any state, much less a state as strong - and as committed to the rule of law - as the United States. Meanwhile, the Russians have - since the early days of the Administration (see here and here) - been smuggling secret weapons to our battlefield adversaries, intent on conducting actual deadly attacks on those service members; and then, following the President's lack of objection, appear to have breathtakingly upped the ante by offering bounties for killing American troops.

It is fair to ask: which of the two - the ICC or the Russians - actually imperils our troops in Afghanistan?; and which - in the words of the President's Executive Order - actually constitutes "an unusual and extraordinary threat" to U.S. national security?

On Thursday, the House Foreign Affairs Committee will hold a hearing titled, "Russian Bounties on U.S. Troops: Why Hasn't the Administration Responded?" The witnesses include Gen. Nicholson and former Acting CIA Director Mike Morrell."



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So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

dab


Wrong, as JB points out...:"agenda"

When Hitler off himself everyone was better off. When tRump is out ( one way or another)
even those who had previously sucked his dick, will spit and back peddle. No one REALLY likes this mother fucking son of a bitch. ( yep: "rage" )

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So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

rt

Unless you get rid of tRump you cannot begin to even consider any "treatment of systematic problems."

Hey dude you still have until November to sort this out in your small brain. Or just come correct now.

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So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

Dab is pointing out that the lesser of evils is still evil. The false equivalence is the suggestion that by NOT voting for Biden then you're voting FOR trump or otherwise supporting him.

Guys like Joe helped create trump, or at least the conditions necessary for there to BE a trump. Unless you treat the systemic problem, the cancer will return and worse.

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“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

Evil is binary
Good is binary

Every individual has a choice as to which one is in the on position.

Google says do no evil. Google does evil things. Is Google evil? If yes, Are all of the people that work for Google evil because they benefit? Or are they just involuntarily complicit because they need a job and are just doing their job?

What about Lt William Calley?

The oath we take as citizens is to our Constitution not a Political Party, Orders or a corporate job.



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Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

I think me and my small brain will be voting for the Green Party.

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“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

Just not an option for this upcoming presidential election.
Dont get me wrong, I have historically supported most of the Green Party platform ( social justice, environmentalism and nonviolence.) for my entire life. Much of the Green party initiatives were embraced by previous democratic presidential candidates, Obama being most prominent. I expect that these ideals will be part of the democratic party platform this time also.

It is much more serious this time.



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So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

"By 69-26, Sanders supporters say their vote is more a vote against Mr. Trump than a vote for Mr. Biden. "

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So if you are a surfer I wish you the prosperity that allows you more time to pursue the salt water dream, and the true happiness that comes from warm water, clean waves and the companionship of your fellow surfers. If you are an internet troll just spewing bs then f off.

JD, I think that is true for many voters. The Republicans Voting Against Trump aren't so much voting for Biden as they are against Trump, myself included.

Biden is a stop gap.

i voted Libertarian in 2016. Not this year and not because I don't believe in much of their platform.


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If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV


Edited: 07/08/2020 at 10:23 AM by Bamboo

Good luck with that....



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The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

^ no GED

^^^sucks dick for a living

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The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

^ beaten as a child

^^^^Sucks dick for a living

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

^ parents hated him

^^^^Sucks dick for a living

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

^ left him on the KKK's doorstep

^^^^Sucks dick for a living

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.

^ he can't get enough

^^^^Sucks dick for a living

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.