Hang 10... or as they now say...hit the lip!

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Topic Title: Sand
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Created On: 10/19/2017 11:30 AM
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 10/22/2017 03:55 PM
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Cole

Posts: 32165
Joined: 07/22/2003

Sorry, but those boards were terrible.



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Trump/Putin 2016!
 10/22/2017 04:50 PM
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TheFirstPeakProject

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Originally posted by: Cole in it's heyday there were only about ten people that caught waves

Respectfully, we don't agree with those of you who downplay the importance of First Peak to the community.  There used to be ESA, NSSA and WQS contests every year.  The King of the Peak contest used to draw world ranked surfers from all over the globe.  The surfing media world was lit up with shots of First Peak on a regular basis.  And just look at the list of champion surfers First Peak bred...Crawford, Slater, Holland, Anderson, Hobgood 2x, Lopez 2x, Morcom, Kechele, Melhado...

We're trying to restore First Peak for our children and give them the chance to become the new breed of champions.  We think it's sad and utterly selfish that a few grumpy old men only think about themselves and how good they had it.  Well, apologies ahead of time guys, and we hate to burst your bubble, but the FPP is not about you.



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The First Peak Project is a 501(c)(3) non-profit public benefit organization whose mission is to restore the legendary surfing wave First Peak at Sebastian Inlet to its former fame and glory.


www.firstpeak.org



Edited: 10/22/2017 at 05:59 PM by TheFirstPeakProject
 10/22/2017 05:56 PM
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pompano

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This is a benefit to the surfing community. Isn't this a surfing forum?  If we are not the ones to be good stewards for surfing, who is?  Why would we not try to promote something that would improve surfing conditions at the inlet?  This is something that could be designed to help stabilize the jetty, improve surfing conditions, provide structure for fish habitat, and give people a chance to surf a legendary wave. 

 10/22/2017 06:53 PM
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Cole

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Joined: 07/22/2003

I'm all for it, knock yourself out.

I'm just jealous I was never one of the ten, though I did score some epic days thanks to no internet.

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Trump/Putin 2016!
 10/23/2017 12:48 AM
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seaspray

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Originally posted by: TheFirstPeakProject
Originally posted by: stokedpanda what if they put up a pump house like at pump house, there is always a deep hole there.

 

 

Now, one thing pumphouses are good for (in terms of improving surf) are the southside breaks of inlets.  Think about Reef Road and outside Boynton Inlet. When they pump sand to the southside, the sand fills in and creates kind-of a point break.  The same thing happens when Austrialia pumps sand from D-bah to Snappers.  The result is super.  So a pumphouse at Sebastian Inlet wouldn't do anything for First Peak, but Monster Hole could line up from up-top to jungle trail. Yew.

 

If anyone is familiar with the Mayport poles break, I surfed there the last time they dredged the St Johns and transferred the filtered sand material south of the Jetty, and what it created was an amazing rippable left. This was back in late winter/early spring 2015. Crazy good wave.

 10/23/2017 04:29 AM
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Tiptime

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It still happens every once in awhile, a couple years back https://youtu.be/2EdoURlF1qc

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The Wavecaster
 10/23/2017 06:08 AM
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matt_t

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IIRC, the wedge continued to exist for a few yrs after the rebuild in 2002/03. We then had the 04 hurricanes which did remove a lot of sand from the systems. It seems the wedge started having issues around the time of the post hurricane beach nourishments in 05/06. I wonder if there is a correlation between the amount of exposed un buried reefs in satbe/Indialantic and the inlet wedge. Both obviously affected by the nourishments.

Its possible that redesigning the jetty to increase the reflection could help wash out all that built up sand... or could ruin it even further.


Maybe another Sandy type N swell could help things out.

Tip's video shows the current potential.
I wonder if looking back through old Mamma G posts would help get a timeline of when the wedge started to disappear.
 10/23/2017 06:42 AM
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leatherneck

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Think it was crowded back then in the 70's-80's.   It would be just like secret light is now overcrowded and full of kooks  .

 10/23/2017 06:50 AM
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Cole

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I'm not sure of the timeline of the two photos, but there seems to be significantly more sand today, than there was before the rebuild.





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Trump/Putin 2016!
 10/23/2017 07:32 AM
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Tiptime

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The beach is different, the jetty is different and add all that sand--not good.

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The Wavecaster
 10/23/2017 09:04 AM
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Cole

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Nice comparison Tip. The straight run of the jetty has been removed from the equation. There is nowhere for the reflection to go. All refraction and no bounce.

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Trump/Putin 2016!
 10/23/2017 10:08 AM
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ClaimingDFL

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To be fair Cole, your panorama appears to be from March, which in my experience is about the height of the buildup of sand down there from our winter time north swells. Check out the photo below from August of this year at around low tide. Looks like the water line is somewhere in between the two aerial images that TipTime shared. [/URL]
 10/23/2017 10:30 AM
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RiddleMe

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Interesting

 

 10/23/2017 03:41 PM
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TheFirstPeakProject

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We clearly highlighted the 6 reasons why we cannot do anything regarding the sand and restoring First Peak.  Please read the first entry of this thread.

The north side of the jetty is referred to as the "North Fillet" by the state park's dredging consultants. The north fillet has been known to flux seasonally for decades.  In the summer the shoreline erodes away, in the winter transport from the north fills the fillet in. It has nothing to do with beach nourishment, especially 20 to 30 miles north.

The Sebastian Inlet Tax District posts these annual reports on their website.  These reports are annual summaries that provide dredging guidance to the inlet district and provide summary data.  Specific data on the north fillet is available for studies such as restoring First Peak.

The state of seasonal erosion has become worse along the fillet has evident in the picture below.  The sea turtle conservancy and fish and wildlife have relocated turtle nests from the shoreline into the dune, which normally was unprecedented but now become and annual practice.

 

Conrete Piles Along Jetty

Sand Removed to Dune

 

Turtle Nests Relocated into Dune


Therefore, in light of these seasonal increases in erosion, any suggestion to dredge the north fillet is not only naive but completely irresponsible. The First Peak Project's official position is that we will not support nor endorse any solution to restore First Peak requires sand manipulation, either placing or dredging, along the north fillet.

This forum can continue to talk about sand all they want. However, until the surfing community starts talking about the reflection, and not the sand, First Peak will not be coming back anytime soon.

Thank you everyone for posting pictures of the inlet and sand but we have all the pictures we need. We have aerial photography dating back to the 1950s. We have also been photographing the sand in the north fillet since 2008.  But we think it's cute that everyone has a point they are trying to make.

Remember: There is nothing we can do about the sand. You're either completely dillusional or totally ignorant of the coastal engineering industry if you think otherwise.  Sorry to sound harsh but that's the reality of the situation. Stop wasting your time.

(On a side note.  If you really think your pictures are worth something, then we need the time stamp.  We have to go back and tide correct the water level to see where the MSL shoreline is located.  Then we have to compare your photo to a photo in our database of the same time period to see if your picture is an anomly or something of interest to us. Chances are it's not.)

 



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The First Peak Project is a 501(c)(3) non-profit public benefit organization whose mission is to restore the legendary surfing wave First Peak at Sebastian Inlet to its former fame and glory.


www.firstpeak.org



Edited: 10/23/2017 at 03:52 PM by TheFirstPeakProject
 10/23/2017 04:34 PM
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chopola

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Its great someone has this passion to try to make change to benefit all surfers. My opinion, you are not going to get approval to attach anything to that jetty. I think you need to direct your effort more on the lines of adding native substrate in front of and in between the existing pilings. I think I have read comments suggesting this, but after watching your white board vid on youtube where you suggested space age composite material attached, that's not gonna happen.
 10/23/2017 05:09 PM
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realsur4

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I think the idea is grand, but after watching the video posted by Cole and Tiptime...in both videos I saw an average of 2 turns and 1 person making it out of a tube. Is the time and effort worth more than 2 turns and a 1/100 tube ride???? I can get that kind of ride anywhere in Brevard on a good day. I would say the benefits of having a "world class" wave in FL is worth striving for, but will it really be world class?
 10/23/2017 05:16 PM
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TheFirstPeakProject

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Originally posted by: chopola My opinion, you are not going to get approval to attach anything to that jetty.

chopla - Before going public with the First Peak Project, we've had conversations with the state park, brevard county and many other entities including the army corps  of engineers.  Everyone is in agreement with the panels. Here's why:

CONTIGENCY. As part of the experimental permit from the Army Corps we must demonstrate that the installation can be simply and easily removed. Not that the installation would be removed, but regardless, we must demonstrate contingency.

With the panels, we can install them in a few hours, watch First Peak return with the next swell or wave event, then remove the panels if necessary.  Agents from the ARMY CORPS like the idea.

What the park and county officials want to see is public demand.  The last thing any of these agencies wants to see is public uproar.  The county and the corps have their hands full with protest groups against the mid-reach, beach nourishment projects, and IRL water quailty issues (such as Lake Okeechobee discharges) . These agencies will NOT endorse another project that causes public unrest, protest, or uproar.  The First Peak Project is trying to create a positive wave of support from the community, but this is obviously not easy.  Surfers appear to be their own worst enemy.

Again, the surfing community does NOT need to worry about sand, or whether or not anyone is going to hurt the jetty. There are many powerful agencies that have people who are paid to worry about these matters.

The surfing community needs to focus on surfing.  This is a forum for surfing and all the threads are placed under a category labelled surfing. Permit compliance, environmental compliance, structural integrity, sand and nearly any other concern should not be a concern of the surfers.  We need to focus on getting our wave back.



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The First Peak Project is a 501(c)(3) non-profit public benefit organization whose mission is to restore the legendary surfing wave First Peak at Sebastian Inlet to its former fame and glory.


www.firstpeak.org



Edited: 10/23/2017 at 05:39 PM by TheFirstPeakProject
 10/23/2017 05:27 PM
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TheFirstPeakProject

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Originally posted by: realsur4 I can get that kind of ride anywhere in Brevard on a good day. I would say the benefits of having a "world class" wave in FL is worth striving for, but will it really be world class?

realsur4 - First Peak was credited with being the birthplace of aerial surfing.  Read the entry in the Encyclopedia of Surfing.  If you surfed it before 2000, you would know why.

The First Peak Project is a restoration project and our goal is to restore First Peak back to pre-2000 conditions.  However, First Peak was created on ACCIDENT.  If we go back an engineer a solution on PURPOSE, it is not a stretch of the imagination to consider the wave could be better than it ever was before.  However, the First Peak Project is not making that claim. Too many people would doubt us.



-------------------------

The First Peak Project is a 501(c)(3) non-profit public benefit organization whose mission is to restore the legendary surfing wave First Peak at Sebastian Inlet to its former fame and glory.


www.firstpeak.org

 10/23/2017 05:30 PM
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WD321

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This whole project is a waist of time if the sand removal can't be addressed. Extend the jetty and be done with it. I'd take a Ponce or Ft. Pierce set up any day over what we have now. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening until the Inlet becomes almost unmanagable to navigation. 

 10/23/2017 06:04 PM
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equipeola

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Originally posted by: WD321  Extend the jetty and be done with it. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening until the Inlet becomes almost unmanagable to navigation.

 

     Ya- it's a hokey setup t'boat outta there on even the smallest ground swell depending on untold factors.

     Extend it, see what happens from a surf perspective, then focus next where feasible. Worst scenario,, the fisherfolk get a speedball, if nothing else, look elsewhere, it's a one man peak t'closeout- build if ya gotta, somewhere else, and,, NEW   



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ola ~

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