Hello, I was just wondering if anyone has heard of Los Suenos Surfboards? Apparently
los suenos just one label out of seven for the overall company Next Level Factory
(never heard of them either). Anyways they are based in Melbourne, Florida and I
follow them on Facebook. It looks like they are producing a good amount of boards but
it's weird because I have never heard of them. They also sell their boards for only
$299 so I don't see how they are making a profit, which leads me to my next question.
If you have heard about them how's the quality? At $299 a board I feel like they
would be of low quality (no real design thought behind each board). I'm getting the
impression that they are just cnc pop outs with the owner just trying to make money
with the way this whole company is set up. Please correct me if I am wrong because a
$299 for a new board would be awesome;however, it sounds too good to be true.


-------------------------


Go Gators

Edited: 02/03/2014 at 03:49 PM by 2nd Light Forums Moderator

its the same guy that owned surfhouse that was on a1a by the pier. he never seemed to care too much about making tons of profit, he just wanted to make the locals happy with some less expensive boards. im not sure about the quality of those boards but i doubt that theyre junk.

I've heard that cost on a surfboard is about $250 not counting overhead. $60 for the blank, about $40 for the resin and cloth, $100 to the shaper, $75 to the glasser/ sander. So thats about $275 already. Even if they are using CNC, someone still has to pay for the maintenance and running of the equipment, not to mention the upfront cost to purchase it. So how do they turn a profit?

Next Level Factory

Quiver 12 testing program

-------------------------
Dora Hates You

The quiver12 testing program is an interesting concept, but just seems kind of odd to me. It's almost like the FCS test center for fins, but you have to pay a monthly fee and then shipping on boards each time. Maybe I'm wrong, but I just can't imagine that many people wanting to do that, when they can talk directly to a local shaper when they want something custom. The other thing is I don't know about you guys, but I have a hard enough time talking myself into buying a board in a shop and that's when I can pick it up, size it up, look at the concaves, check the width of the tail, thickness, and then go nah I don't like it and pick up the next one and do the same thing. (I do this over and over until I can finally make up my mind on something and if I can't then I'll eventually decide on getting a custom)

The thing is, each of our local shapers or surf shops has something unique, which makes buying boards from them so great and that's why we go to them continually even if it's slightly more expensive. When you're buying a board in a shop you want to talk to a person and look at all the different options. That's just 1/2 the experience and is also something that you don't get when your buying online. 

Overall even with an online board testing program you wouldn't get that same personal feel as you do in a shop, but it would be cool if they started to do it in the local surf shops. This way you don't have to buy multiple boards to determine what you like or be so careful on getting just the right size for you immediately. It would be kind of like a board rental or board swap program, so people don't feel like they have to throw down $400-600 until they know what they want. Then when they are ready, maybe after 2-3 weeks and trying several different boards at $100 a week, then they can choose the board they want to ride.

Edited: 02/01/2014 at 10:51 PM by Sector9surf

Well I am glad to hear that he's been around the area for a little while. I am still just kinda confused as to why he is trying to run 7 different brands under the head name "NextLevelFactory". To my knowledge from pictures posted on Facebook it looks to be just him and maybe 1 or 2 other guys running the entire thing. If so, why so many labels (gromstix, azulh20, h2boards, ethan shapes, los suenos, beard boards, and molecule)? I've never seen something like this before and I am just curious about the reason for it. Also I haven't seen any pictures of them hand shaping boards but I have seen pics/videos of them using a cnc machine.


-------------------------


Go Gators

I'm glad you asked the question. Though our market is not CB we have 

different labels because that what the market demands. Its not going to hurt our 

feeling if the locals dont want to buy boards from a CNC machine, though thats 

90% of all the boards in the area are from CNC with 10% being hand tuned. 

Anybody telling you different is just Lying to your face.







Another interesting thing is the comments left by other that the cost is $250 near 

$300. If that be the case why would one not want to buy it. I was not the owner of 

Surfhouse, just managing it and at the end of the day I walked because of all the 

crooked vendors and having to deal with the owners wife. If you believe that the 

cost is X and we are selling them at X that means something is totally wrong, either 

board builders Lie or we just don't like making money. You will need to figure that 

one out yourself.







If your interested in quiver12.com is the right option as you can test the board and 

send it back, if you like all 12 boards keep all 12 for an additional $169. This is a no

 brainer. Go read the Q&A on quiver12.com







Im not here to make friends Im here to sell Boards and sad thing is Im being 

persecuted for doing it. I get "takeprideinwhatyouride" crap, hell I use the same 

materials and some of the materials are better and more costly than most shops, 

and I get that crap of stupid people comments, I tried to work with locals as to 

which I am, "I went to school here and lived here" most shapers arent even from 

here WTF. In trying to work with locals they either steal, dont pay you back, hold 

worthless crap over your head, lie and so on.







At the end of the day we are producing 16 boards a day and increasing our building 

size, production and JOBS which none other do. Im doing this to sell good boards 

inexpensive and quality so people stop buying chinese crap. Go read our Blog on 

nextlevelfactory.com and you will see our passion to make change.







At this point Im in Central America selling more Boards then we can produce and at

 the end of the day we and our labels will be around for a LONG TIME, so others 

need to get use to it, while they are complaining Im selling and making Boards.







THANKS FOR YOUR INTEREST,







If your interested in continuing paying HIGH prices for the same BOARDS then by 

all means HAVE AT IT. 

Edited: 02/03/2014 at 03:50 PM by 2nd Light Forums Moderator

I wasn't trying to put you or your company down at all. I was simply curious about this local company which I never heard of that seemed to be mass producing boards. The quiver12 program is definitely innovative also. How many people are taking advantage of this so far? I'm not against the cnc machine if the designer knows how to shape a quality board by hand also. I'm a believer that you have to start shaping the old school way before working up to a cnc machine not the other way around. As for the mark up I would estimate it would only cost you guys about $200 to make a board with the way you guys are set up (buy in bulk, specific designs, performance boards only, not much color work). You guys are definitely smart in the way you're going about things. In fact, if your demand continues up I'm sure you'll make decent money contrary to belief. At an estimated $1600 a day right now isn't too shabby and you guys are growing so good luck! Btw if you ever need a part time glasser I'll be back in town over summer looking for work.

-------------------------


Go Gators

Centralamericasurf,

Thanks for the straight talk about your business. Very interesting.



-------------------------
Dora Hates You

Thanks for the response, i tend to usually defend myself like everyone else and usually get called and Ahole for dooing it. Doesnt really matter when your to busy to think. I wont deny we use CNC machines and I wont deny we use Ghost shapers to tune the boards, but at the end of the day technologies when any day over hand shapes, dont believe me? bring any hand shape board to me and ill scan in both sides and show you nothing but inconsistencies. You are always going to have a dominant side with hand shapes and by the way try telling Channel Islands, Lost and Fire Wire that crap and they wont loose a wink of sleep just as I wont. Like I said if your happy about paying high prices for boards and you "proud for what you ride" then so be it. Im proud to save $200 after purchasing a better quality board without the pressure of filling guilty for spending so much money. I have a deal for anyone that likes what Im saying, If you want a Board and feel like you want to spend $550 than so be it, ILL Give you TWO (2) Boards for that price any of my labels, just email sales@nextlevelfactory.com and will hook you up with custom order sheets and if you dont like it after 30 days ILL GIVE YOU YOUR MONEY BACK. 100% GUARANTEED 

edit:  margin problem (maybe) resolved.  Thanks.

Edited: 02/03/2014 at 03:45 PM by ww

DUPLICATE MESSAGE WITH MARGINS FIXED:

I'm glad you asked the question. Though our market is not CB we have 

different labels because that what the market demands. Its not going to 

hurt our feeling if the locals dont want to buy boards from a CNC machine, 

though thats 90% of all the boards in the area are from CNC with 10% 

being hand tuned. Anybody telling you different is just Lying to your face.

Another interesting thing is the comments left by other that the cost is 

$250 near $300. If that be the case why would one not want to buy it. 

I was not the owner of Surfhouse, just managing it and at the end of the 

day I walked because of all the crooked vendors and having to deal with 

the owners wife. If you believe that the cost is X and we are selling them 

at X that means something is totally wrong, either board builders Lie or we 

just don't like making money. You will need to figure that one out yourself.

If your interested in quiver12.com is the right option as you can test the 

board and send it back, if you like all 12 boards keep all 12 for an additional 

$169. This is a no brainer. Go read the Q&A on quiver12.com

Im not here to make friends Im here to sell Boards and sad thing is Im 

being persecuted for doing it. I get "takeprideinwhatyouride" crap, hell I

use the same materials and some of the materials are better and more 

costly than most shops, and I get that crap of stupid people comments, 

I tried to work with locals as to which I am, 

"I went to school here and lived here"

 most shapers arent even from here WTF. In trying to work with locals 

they either steal, dont pay you back, hold worthless crap over your head, 

lie and so on.

At the end of the day we are producing 16 boards a day and increasing 

our building size, production and JOBS which none other do. Im doing 

this to sell good boards inexpensive and quality so people stop buying 

chinese crap. Go read our Blog on nextlevelfactory.com and you will see 

our passion to make change.

At this point Im in Central America selling more Boards then we can produce 

and at the end of the day we and our labels will be around for a LONG TIME, 

so others need to get use to it, while they are complaining Im selling and 

making Boards.

THANKS FOR YOUR INTEREST,

If your interested in continuing paying HIGH prices for the same BOARDS 

then by all means HAVE AT IT. 

REPLY DUPLICATE MESSAGE WITH MARGINS FIXED

Thanks for the response, i tend to usually defend myself like everyone else and

usually get called and Ahole for doing it.Doesnt really matter when your to busy to

think. I wont deny we use CNC machines and I wont deny we use Ghost shapers to

tune the boards, but at the end of the day technologies win any day over hand
shapes,
dont believe me? Bring any hand shape board to me and ill scan in both sides and

show you nothing but inconsistencies. You are always going to have a dominant
side
with hand shapes and by the way try telling Channel Islands, Lost and Fire Wire
that
crap and they wont loose a wink of sleep just as I wont. Like I said if your happy
about
paying high prices for boards and you "proud for what you ride" then so be it. Im

proud to save $200 after purchasing a better quality board without the pressure of

filling guilty for spending so much money. I have a deal for anyone that likes what

Im
saying, If you want a Board and feel like you want to spend $550 than so be it, ILL

Give you TWO (2) Boards for that price any of my labels, just email

sales@nextlevelfactory.com and will hook you up with custom order sheets and if

you
dont like it after 30 days ILL GIVE YOU YOUR MONEY BACK. 100% GUARANTEED



Edited: 02/03/2014 at 03:47 PM by 2nd Light Forums Moderator

Thanks for the response, i tend to usually defend myself like everyone else and

usually get called and Ahole for doing it.Doesnt really matter when your to busy to

think. I wont deny we use CNC machines and I wont deny we use Ghost shapers

to tune the boards, but at the end of the day technologies win any day over hand

shapes, dont believe me? Bring any hand shape board to me and ill scan in both

sides and show you nothing but inconsistencies. You are always going to have a

dominant side with hand shapes and by the way try telling Channel Islands, Lost

and Fire Wire that crap and they wont loose a wink of sleep just as I wont. Like I

said if your happy about paying high prices for boards and you "proud for what

you ride" then so be it. Im proud to save $200 after purchasing a better quality

board without the pressure of filling guilty for spending so much money. I have a

deal for anyone that likes what Im saying, If you want a Board and feel like you

want to spend $550 than so be it, ILL Give you TWO (2) Boards for that price any

of my labels, just email sales@nextlevelfactory.com and will hook you up with

custom order sheets and if you dont like it after 30 days ILL GIVE YOU YOUR

MONEY BACK. 100% GUARANTEED 

Thanks Dingpatch, its refreshing to know we still have thinkers 

I agree 100% that every hand-shaped board has inconsistencies but symmetry doesn't always mean a better board. We can talk about asymmetrical boards all day but I think you just meant that a cnc is more accurate than the hands of a shaper, I agree. I still believe anyone designing a board on a computer should have learned from hand shaping because SO much knowledge is gained from it. Btw I have never finished off a cnc shaped board but I am sure that the symmetry isn't perfect either after smoothing it out. Most likely more symmetric than a hand shaped board but I bet if you scan it you'd see some asymmetry (even more so if the guy smoothing it out doesn't have experience hand shaping a board). I support cnc machines fully if they are operated correctly. You can really fine tune a board if you know what you're doing and get almost identical copies time after time.

-------------------------


Go Gators

Please don't advertise on the surfing forum, thanks.

I don't think it's a bad idea, just saying it's hard to tell what you're getting when you buy online. Plus there's always the hidden costs, such as shipping. For a broke surfer I can't imagine paying to and return shipping for trying a new board each time. By the time you purchase something you might as well just have walked into a shop and spent $500 dollars because even if you're are only paying $300 then add shipping, then fins, then trak pad and you're right back to $400-450 which I believe is about what they sell for in a shop.

Maybe your costs are low enough to do it, but I don't see shops wanting to sell them for $300 because they would have to make a profit too so would be getting them for what $200 each?(I'm not exactly sure what the markup is on boards). Then again who say's you have to sell them through shops, some people may prefer getting them directly from you guys, but I think from a business perspective that's something that the owner has to make a choice. That or by selling through shops and going for volume even though you make less profit per board, you can make more profit overall by selling more. I'm not really sure though. I'm no expert, just learning and wondering how it works. (I have noticed some companies, which claim to be the manufacturer, distributor, and retailer all in one which do have lower prices and claim this to be the reason)

It's true that alot of boards are CNC'd now, and if ALL shapers were business minded maybe they'd do the same thing and sell global like you guys, but from what I know most are still selling locally and some are still handshaping. However, in the end it's about the big picture and not what others think about you anyways. If that's what you want to do and it makes you happy, who cares how you do it. Besides technology and progression are going to be an ever changing and who knows what's next. Eventually we may have robots making surfboards.(Then who's selling out?). Either way there are two types of buyers; ones looking for inexpensive (progression through science and technology) and then the ones who are willing to pay more for what I like to call "artistic expression". These people are buying handshaped boards because of the shaper's artistic talent to create a unique and custom piece of art each time in which they get a great satisfaction out of.

I am curious to know how your custom board program works? Am I able to design it myself or work with a designer, and then get it glassed? (Wait a minute, I mean work with the shaper), and then get it glassed for $300. Also, if I am going to spend big bucks, I want to know that it's top quality. What thickness of glassing do you use? 2 layers of 4oz on top and 4 on the bottom? How much more to make it 12oz and 8oz? Do you do longboards as well? EPS or poly? (All this info has be known if I am truly to determine that your factory is better quality and priced, than the other guys).

One last dumb question, which is not neccesarily about your factory, but more about where CNC machines and technology are right now. Do they have the technology yet where you can bring old boards in, run it through a scanner and get an exact replica made? What I'm kind of imagining with this is being able to push a board through an xray type scanner(such as at the airport), and then seeing a board instantly shaped and glassed(with UV resing) by a machine, directly in front of you through a glass window for $200 bucks or less. Just think about how cool it would be to be able to do that.

Edited: 02/07/2014 at 06:11 PM by Sector9surf

Sector9surf most of the questions can be answered on their quiver12 website but basically they are running it for high production and keeping it simple to keep cost down. Only performance shortboards are available, standard glassing schedule (6oz bottom 12oz deck), I think you have to pay shipping unless you're returning the board then it's free apparently, and they aren't in shops because it seems like he doesn't need to do that. Apparently he has a full load of work currently by the way he's running his business. I have to give him credit for doing what no one else dared to do and if I was running low on money and wanted a custom board I'd probably pick a model and send him the dimensions I wanted for $300.

-------------------------


Go Gators

 

Edited: 02/07/2014 at 10:59 PM by undrgrndshayps