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Topic Title: "Back to School" arguments
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Created On: 07/24/2020 06:00 AM
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 07/24/2020 06:00 AM
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dingpatch

Posts: 19032
Joined Forum: 07/24/2003

OK, every story has two sides, , , ,

On one hand we have the "kids don't get COVID", and otherwise don't really get sick from it argument, , , , ,

On the other hand we have the "kids need school" side that make various claims why children need to be in school for a lot of reasons that have not too much to do with actual class room instruction.

My guess is that the first excuse will result in an absolute Royal Cluster Fuck Cage Match with sick kids and dead parents and extended family members. But, that's just my out-dated, natural, paranoid, "preserve life" thinking.

The second excuse is pretty interesting. Ya, ya, kids really do need to have some "normalcy" in their lives. But, at the same time, they also need to be exposed to, and subsequently understand, that Life Sucks and that the sooner you get over it, the better. In my case, born in 1951, I grew up with a couple different, and profound, disruptions: Cuba and Vietnam. The "Cuban Missile Crisis" was pretty terrifying for us elementary school kids. I grew up here in Brevard right next to Patrick AFB. Khrushchev said that he would bury us. Everybody else said that it could be the "End of the World". The 40+ fighter aircraft that flew into Patrick were pretty exciting but, , ,! The Hawk missile sites put in along the coast pretty much said it all. But, the absolute worst of it was the "Duck and Cover" drills!! Get on the floor, get under your desk, hands over head, and face away from The Cape so that you were not blinded by the nuclear flash. The Vietnam "thing" was another ordeal for us to endure. Going to high school at Satellite was pretty "Space Coast" cool but, having to live through those years with the threat of being drafted and sent into combat in "Nam" was not at all pleasant.

Discuss.

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Dora Hates You

Edited: 07/24/2020 at 12:45 PM by dingpatch
 07/24/2020 06:17 AM
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Sniper

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In addition to some of the arguments you've already mentioned, schools need school.

If public schools stop allowing kids to be kids, including socializing, playing, and learning, then the parents who can afford to take their kids to private options will do so QUICKLY. What do you think that means for public schools? I can see a scenario where public schools end up being pretty much only for the poor. What do you think that does for school funding? Do you think parents are going to be eager to dump a bunch of money into a system that they get nothing from? (I could be wrong here. I don't know how private schools are funded or if they accept any money from the federal government)

I can also see a scenario where groups of families get together to form some kind of small scale school. Basically like homeschool but you have 15-20 kids and their parents pay the teacher.

If either of these scenarios plays out, where do you think the good teachers are going to go? Think they are going to stay in the system that is starving for funding and deteriorating or the one with less red tape, more flexibility, and probably higher paying?

-------------------------
"The government who robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul," - George Bernard Shaw

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to f—k things up.” - Barack Obama

“End of quote. Repeat the line.” - wise words from Joe Biden
 07/24/2020 06:34 AM
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Bamboo

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Currently, the Brevard schools are looking at essentially 4 options for the kids.

1. BVS - Brevard Virtual School: not tied to a brick an mortar school. 100% from home. Similar to Home Schooling.

2. eLearning - child is tied to a brick and mortar school but attends classes over computer. Keeps school hours and interlaces with teacher virtually.
3. Full time in School
4. Mix of eLearning and In School (maybe 2 days In School/3 days eLearning)

Most parents I know are leaning towards eLearning or the Mix.
A few are going BVS, which is great if your family situation allows it.

The State Gov screwed this up with the mandate.

Talked to school administrators earlier this week and their desire is to let those who want to do BVS do it, and then start the school year with eLearning and transitioning into a Mix and then going back full time when Covid19 resolves. For children who don't have the home support for elearning accommodations would be made.



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If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV
 07/24/2020 06:45 AM
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Sniper

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To me, it seems like the people who like the idea of a large public school program with the majority of children in the country going to public schools should be pushing to get kids back to school, as it was pre-Covid as soon as possible. I don't see how any of the other proposed options do anything good for public schools and their funding. I'm not in love with the idea of paying for private school but I will do it if I feel like that is the best option.

-------------------------
"The government who robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul," - George Bernard Shaw

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to f—k things up.” - Barack Obama

“End of quote. Repeat the line.” - wise words from Joe Biden
 07/24/2020 06:50 AM
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Sniper

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Originally posted by: Bamboo

Currently, the Brevard schools are looking at essentially 4 options for the kids.

1. BVS - Brevard Virtual School: not tied to a brick an mortar school. 100% from home. Similar to Home Schooling.

2. eLearning - child is tied to a brick and mortar school but attends classes over computer. Keeps school hours and interlaces with teacher virtually.

3. Full time in School

4. Mix of eLearning and In School (maybe 2 days In School/3 days eLearning)

Most parents I know are leaning towards eLearning or the Mix.

A few are going BVS, which is great if your family situation allows it.

The State Gov screwed this up with the mandate.

Talked to school administrators earlier this week and their desire is to let those who want to do BVS do it, and then start the school year with eLearning and transitioning into a Mix and then going back full time when Covid19 resolves. For children who don't have the home support for elearning accommodations would be made.


That's interesting that you say most of the parents you talk to are leaning towards the mixed approach. It seems like that option still has a lot of potential to expose kids to the virus and still prevents parents from being able to work a normal schedule. I don't see the positive for this one.

-------------------------
"The government who robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul," - George Bernard Shaw

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to f—k things up.” - Barack Obama

“End of quote. Repeat the line.” - wise words from Joe Biden
 07/24/2020 06:55 AM
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Greensleeves

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This was in Brevard county's opening plan:

"Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. "

Then why the hell do we have summer break? Hey teacher you need to be on the lookout for suicidal ideation.

Dear Lord!

 07/24/2020 06:58 AM
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TATTOO74

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Originally posted by: Sniper

In addition to some of the arguments you've already mentioned, schools need school.



If public schools stop allowing kids to be kids, including socializing, playing, and learning, then the parents who can afford to take their kids to private options will do so QUICKLY. What do you think that means for public schools? I can see a scenario where public schools end up being pretty much only for the poor. What do you think that does for school funding? Do you think parents are going to be eager to dump a bunch of money into a system that they get nothing from? (I could be wrong here. I don't know how private schools are funded or if they accept any money from the federal government)



I can also see a scenario where groups of families get together to form some kind of small scale school. Basically like homeschool but you have 15-20 kids and their parents pay the teacher.



If either of these scenarios plays out, where do you think the good teachers are going to go? Think they are going to stay in the system that is starving for funding and deteriorating or the one with less red tape, more flexibility, and probably higher paying?


This has been the talk in the small group of parents I know.

 07/24/2020 07:00 AM
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Sniper

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You also have plenty of toxic parents out there who just don't give a shit in general.

What are their kids going to be up to if they are forced to be home part-time or full time?

-------------------------
"The government who robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul," - George Bernard Shaw

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to f—k things up.” - Barack Obama

“End of quote. Repeat the line.” - wise words from Joe Biden
 07/24/2020 07:03 AM
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TATTOO74

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That's the other side of the argument. Parents have to get back to work, like it or not and send their kids to school in order to do that. Some do not have a choice. Single parents for example. I am glad my son is still too young for school and don't have to deal with this mess.
 07/24/2020 07:23 AM
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RustyTruck

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Pressuring parents back to work is a bit part of this whole thing. School doubles as day care for most wage workers.

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Capitalism is based on the ridiculous notion that you can enjoy limitless growth in a closed, finite system.

In biology, such behavior of cells is called "cancer".
 07/24/2020 07:33 AM
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Sniper

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The more I think about it, it seems like this is more likely than not the death of the public education system as we know it, regardless of which option you choose.

If you make all the kids stay home then all the money goes to private options when the families who can afford it put their kids in private schools.

If you open the schools up, you still won't be able to let kids play outside and be kids. It will be like a prison but without time in the yard. What happens when one kid in a class tests positive? The entire class stays at home for 14 days? If this method of school sucks worse than what school already did, which it definitely will, then the parents who can afford to put their kids in a private school do it.

Then we will be left with an even more divided country when you have rich schools and poor schools.

Come on vaccine...if we get a vaccine worked out quickly then none of this stuff is an issue. Right now, we don't even know if a vaccine is possible.

-------------------------
"The government who robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul," - George Bernard Shaw

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to f—k things up.” - Barack Obama

“End of quote. Repeat the line.” - wise words from Joe Biden
 07/24/2020 07:37 AM
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Fish Killer

Posts: 71439
Joined Forum: 10/09/2005

The democraps just assassinated their indoctrination facility!

Cool!

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The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.
 07/24/2020 07:37 AM
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RustyTruck

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Nah, if it destroyed the public schools then DeVos and trump would be all about it.

Vaccine in the spring-summer, back to normal Fall 2021.

-------------------------
Capitalism is based on the ridiculous notion that you can enjoy limitless growth in a closed, finite system.

In biology, such behavior of cells is called "cancer".
 07/24/2020 07:42 AM
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Fish Killer

Posts: 71439
Joined Forum: 10/09/2005

Originally posted by: RustyTruck

Nah, if it destroyed the public schools then DeVos and trump would be all about it.



Vaccine in the spring-summer, back to normal Fall 2021.


Bwahahahahahahahh!

Not happening!

Vaccines are what percent viable?

How's that Flu vaccine working?

-------------------------
The REAL truth is....both of the forum idiots are OWNED.
-BOTH of them have no clue who their owner is.
-They are both card carrying narcissists.
^These are PROVED facts.
 07/24/2020 07:46 AM
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Sniper

Posts: 8759
Joined Forum: 09/24/2003

I'm trying to be cautiously/realistically optimistic about the vaccine. The worst thing people can do is to assume that we will definitely have a vaccine soon and not plan for further down the road in the event that a vaccine isn't possible.

-------------------------
"The government who robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul," - George Bernard Shaw

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to f—k things up.” - Barack Obama

“End of quote. Repeat the line.” - wise words from Joe Biden
 07/24/2020 08:00 AM
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Bamboo

Posts: 7985
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Snipe, I said e-learning or mix.
If the in class situation allows for space and cleanliness then going a couple days a week is very desirable.
If not then e-learning it is until it is safe to return part time of full time.

Parents will be allowed to make changes to learning environment choice as the covid situation changes.

All things considered I think the administrators have been doing good work to provide options and still comply with the stupid state mandate.

-------------------------
If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV
 07/24/2020 08:30 AM
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Sniper

Posts: 8759
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Unfortunately, I think the school administrators, teachers, and faculty of public schools are in a no-win situation. I have no doubt that they are trying to accommodate everyone but I just don't see how that is possible.

-------------------------
"The government who robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul," - George Bernard Shaw

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to f—k things up.” - Barack Obama

“End of quote. Repeat the line.” - wise words from Joe Biden
 07/24/2020 08:52 AM
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dingpatch

Posts: 19032
Joined Forum: 07/24/2003

The "child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation." thing is a real kicker. Sure, sure, probably pretty important BUT, if it really is that big of a BFD, then DCF should be checking on EVERY child at home every week, school or no school. Right? LOL

And, if "food" is really that big of a deal, then the Government should be delivering meals to kids at home every day.

Yesterday, or Wednesday, I listened to somebody talking about this. I think that they said that 70%+- of "abuse" cases are reported by teachers at school!

So, ya, ya, ya, school just may be a pretty important component of "over sight" by the Government.

But, then again, if this was something like Scarlet Fever, , , , what in hell would we be doing to "monitor" all the kids, if not at school?


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Dora Hates You
 07/24/2020 09:02 AM
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tpapablo

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Probably doesn't matter much one way or another. Not going to school clearly will set these kids back for a long time, if not for life.They will be at a disadvantage vis a vis their peers who did go to school in most aspects of life. But then again, with the garbage being taught in schools these days, they might be better off.

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I :heart; Q
 07/24/2020 09:30 AM
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HAPDigital

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Yesterday Trump said "if schools do not reopen the funding should go to parents."
FORUMS : National Enquirer (FORMERLY NSR) : "Back to School" arguments

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