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Topic Title: Webb Telescope
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Created On: 12/28/2021 03:43 PM
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 Webb Telescope   - dingpatch - 12/28/2021 03:43 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - Burry - 12/29/2021 05:18 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - CurtisEflush - 12/29/2021 08:38 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - johnnyboy - 12/29/2021 08:43 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - Cole - 12/29/2021 02:39 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - StirfryMcflurry - 12/29/2021 02:53 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - CurtisEflush - 12/29/2021 05:58 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - crankit - 12/30/2021 11:13 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - dingpatch - 12/30/2021 11:48 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - StirfryMcflurry - 12/30/2021 08:45 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - Bamboo - 12/31/2021 05:22 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - pompano - 01/01/2022 05:32 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - Burry - 01/01/2022 05:42 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - StirfryMcflurry - 01/01/2022 08:37 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - RiddleMe - 01/01/2022 10:35 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - Bamboo - 01/02/2022 05:57 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - crankit - 01/03/2022 11:36 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - Cole - 12/30/2021 02:55 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - johnnyboy - 01/03/2022 01:00 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - StirfryMcflurry - 01/03/2022 03:30 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - Burry - 01/03/2022 08:16 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - Burry - 01/04/2022 10:06 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - dingpatch - 06/29/2022 01:17 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - dingpatch - 07/12/2022 04:40 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - 3rdworldlover - 07/12/2022 09:03 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - dingpatch - 07/12/2022 12:45 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - LIV2SURFDT - 07/12/2022 05:05 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - dingpatch - 07/13/2022 06:48 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - worksuxgetsponsered - 07/14/2022 04:37 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - Cole - 07/16/2022 12:39 PM  
 Webb Telescope   - Pagerow - 09/13/2022 08:57 AM  
 Webb Telescope   - worksuxgetsponsered - 09/13/2022 09:50 AM  
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 12/28/2021 03:43 PM
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dingpatch

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Way back, in the 2000's, , , , , I worked for a defense contractor as a Sr, Subcontract Administrator. One of my main suppliers was a contractor in Alabama that was, pretty much, "Number One" anywhere. They manufactured the "sensor support housing" for an Army weapons sighting system that we worked on. The beryllium was "pure" in regard to DoD standards and such. Just the near-net-shape "blank" (you can call it a casting, but is not made like a "normal" metal casting). Anyway, just the price of the "blank" from the only qualified refiner was $42K each with a minimum order of 4 pieces. The machining and testing was $27K each with a quality level of NO DEFECTS and No reworks. The slightest "miss-cut" resulted in Scrap.

So, , , , , anyway, , , , a couple of times I went to their location for Program Reviews and such I got to see the Webb's mirrors being machined. As with the Army part I was responsible for, the Webb mirrors were following the same DoD material specs and such, with a very heavy layer of NASA spread all over it, and had volumes of paper for "quality", "safety", and such.

The "base price" for the mirror "castings" was $76K each. I did not know for sure about the "machining" part of the costs but, it could have easily been another $100K each.

Oh and, the mirrors that I saw in-work were not "Deliverables".

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Edited: 07/14/2022 at 05:20 AM by dingpatch
 12/29/2021 05:18 AM
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Burry

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Cool stuff Ding!!!!

i am on the edge for the next 25 days as "the Gadget" is starting to unfurl....

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 12/29/2021 08:38 AM
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CurtisEflush

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It's neat when you live long enough to see some of these long-gestating babies grow up and do their thing. I'm hoping the same for one I've worked on.

NASA definitely learned a few things from Perkin-Elmer's mirror mistake on the Hubble Space Telescope:

Hubble's primary mirror was built by what was then called Perkin-Elmer Corporation, in Danbury, Connecticut. Once Hubble began returning images that were less clear than expected, NASA undertook an investigation to diagnose the problem. Ultimately the problem was traced to miscalibrated equipment during the mirror's manufacture. The result was a mirror with an aberration one-50th the thickness of a human hair, in the grinding of the mirror.

Replacing the mirror was not practical, so the best solution was to build replacement instruments that fixed the flaw much the same way a pair of glasses correct the vision of a near-sighted person. The corrective optics and new instruments were built and installed on Hubble by spacewalking astronauts during a shuttle mission in 1993. The Corrective Optics Space Telescope Axial Replacement (COSTAR) instrument, about the size of a telephone booth, placed into Hubble five pairs of corrective mirrors that countered the effects of the flaw.


https://www.nasa.gov/content/hubbles-mirror-flaw
 12/29/2021 08:43 AM
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johnnyboy

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The origami involved is amazing. I'm fascinated by the whole thing. The heat shield. The precision, the planning. This telescope was its own economy.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

 12/29/2021 02:39 PM
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Cole

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Can someone explain the one million mile position to me? Is it just sitting in space or is there still some minor influence from the Earth?

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 12/29/2021 02:53 PM
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StirfryMcflurry

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I would attempt to try coal, butt - judging from your posts over in NSR, its..... over your head
 12/29/2021 05:58 PM
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CurtisEflush

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Originally posted by: Cole
Can someone explain the one million mile position to me? Is it just sitting in space or is there still some minor influence from the Earth?


Summary quoted below. More details, images, and a cool animation here.

The James Webb Space Telescope will not be in orbit around the Earth, like the Hubble Space Telescope is - it will actually orbit the Sun, 1.5 million kilometers (1 million miles) away from the Earth at what is called the second Lagrange point or L2. What is special about this orbit is that it lets the telescope stay in line with the Earth as it moves around the Sun. This allows the satellite's large sunshield to protect the telescope from the light and heat of the Sun and Earth (and Moon).


 12/30/2021 11:13 AM
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crankit

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Was the blank a forging or casting, and Beryllium is a banned materiel in most places now.

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 12/30/2021 11:48 AM
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dingpatch

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The "blank" is made by the process of Hot Isostatic Pressing. The beryllium used is more-or-less in a powder form and it is then "pressed" in a "mold" under very high pressure and temperature.

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Edited: 12/30/2021 at 11:49 AM by dingpatch
 12/30/2021 08:45 PM
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StirfryMcflurry

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Originally posted by: crankit Beryllium is a banned materiel in most places now.
ONLY ON PLANET KKKRANKY. The use of beryllium and beryllium-containing materials is not banned, restricted or otherwise limited by any country worldwide.
 12/31/2021 05:22 AM
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Bamboo

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just an FYI - Beryllium is certainly not a banned material. In it's pure and alloyed forms it is used all the time in aerospace applications, and will be for a long time because it has unique properties.

OSHA and the DoD are now more sensitive about its handling and machining and there are warnings, but nothing really crazy.
Fine Be dust or BeO is what you need to be careful with as it can cause lung issues and cancer. Handling solid Be isn't an issue at all, but it is recommended to treat it like you handled Pb....don't eat, don't smoke, don't lick your fingers, and wash your hands well after handling it.

Trivia bonus points - some 1911 brands used to use BeCu as their frame material and it is used in musical instruments like tambourines, too.



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If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV
 01/01/2022 05:32 AM
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pompano

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Yeah, we use beryllium compounds in aerospace applications. It is just a hassle to work with, and probably why Crankit thought it was banned, as he couldn't work with it in his shop due to the protocols (no sanding, collect all residuals, must do training, etc.). expect to continue to hear more about the Lagrange points.
 01/01/2022 05:42 AM
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Burry

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The arms are extended!!!! next is for the shields to be tightened up!

crankit once had a Beryllium enema and i think that is maybe what he is talking about!!!!

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Inflation caused The BIG BANG...look it up!
 01/01/2022 08:37 AM
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StirfryMcflurry

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Originally posted by: Burry crankit once had a Beryllium enema and i think that is maybe what he is talking about!!!!
LMAO 5/5 &
 01/01/2022 10:35 AM
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RiddleMe

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Originally posted by: Burry
crankit once had a Beryllium enema and i think that is maybe what he is talking about!!!!


Hahahahaaaa
 01/02/2022 05:57 AM
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Bamboo

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Originally posted by: Burry

The arms are extended!!!! next is for the shields to be tightened up!



crankit once had a Beryllium enema and i think that is maybe what he is talking about!!!!


LOL, well played burry!

(Actually, I had one after an injury. The tech introduced herself as "Hi, my name is Olga and I'll be giving you the procedure". I was like awwwww crap....
She was actually really nice and had a great sense of humor.)



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If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD WAS MUSIC - KV
 01/03/2022 11:36 AM
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crankit

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Methinks burry is confused (hopefully not age related) about his Barium enema, which is radioactive whereas beryllium can be carcinogenic and would not be used as an enema!

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 12/30/2021 02:55 PM
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Cole

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Originally posted by: CurtisEflush

Originally posted by: Cole

Can someone explain the one million mile position to me? Is it just sitting in space or is there still some minor influence from the Earth?




Summary quoted below. More details, images, and a cool animation here.



The James Webb Space Telescope will not be in orbit around the Earth, like the Hubble Space Telescope is - it will actually orbit the Sun, 1.5 million kilometers (1 million miles) away from the Earth at what is called the second Lagrange point or L2. What is special about this orbit is that it lets the telescope stay in line with the Earth as it moves around the Sun. This allows the satellite's large sunshield to protect the telescope from the light and heat of the Sun and Earth (and Moon).


Quite impressive, as were the maths involved.

I really hope they pull it off with no hitches.



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 01/03/2022 01:00 PM
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johnnyboy

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IF this unfolds and comes together perfectly, this will be a pivotal moment in our species understanding of our universe.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

 01/03/2022 03:30 PM
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StirfryMcflurry

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Originally posted by: johnnyboy IF this unfolds and comes together perfectly, this will be a pivotal moment in our species understanding of ....our anoverse.
lol! BURRY'S, OR CRANKY'S?
 01/03/2022 08:16 PM
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Burry

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"The Webb team has completed tensioning for the first three layers of the observatory's kite-shaped sunshield, 47 feet across and 70 feet long.

The first layer - pulled fully taut into its final configuration - was completed mid-afternoon.

The team began the second layer at 4:09 pm EST today, and the process took 74 minutes. The third layer began at 5:48 pm EST, and the process took 71 minutes. In all, the tensioning process from the first steps this morning until the third layer achieved tension took just over five and a half hours.

These three layers are the ones closest to the Sun. Tensioning of the final two layers is planned for tomorrow."


You are safe for now crankit.....no mention of enemas!

Bamboo...Olga from the 'old county' ...

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 01/04/2022 10:06 AM
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Burry

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ALL FIVE LAYERS ACHIEVED TENSION>>>!!!!!!

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 06/29/2022 01:17 PM
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dingpatch

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https://www.nbcnews.com/scienc...s-are-coming-rcna35902

The first full-color photos from the James Webb Space Telescope are coming
NASA and its partners, the European and Canadian space agencies, will unveil the first full-color images from the Webb telescope in a much-anticipated event on July 12.

June 29, 2022, 3:10 PM EDT
By Denise Chow

The first images from NASA's next-generation James Webb Space Telescope are set to be released next month and will include the deepest view of the universe ever taken, agency officials confirmed Wednesday.

NASA and its partners, the European Space Agency and the Canadian Space Agency, will unveil the initial batch of full-color images from the Webb telescope in a much-anticipated event on July 12. The $10 billion observatory is humanity's largest and most powerful space telescope, and experts have said it could revolutionize our understanding of the cosmos.

Thomas Zurbuchen, associate administrator of NASA's Science Mission Directorate, said that seeing the first images from the Webb telescope will be an emotional milestone for humanity - a moment he described as witnessing nature "giving up secrets that have been there for many, many decades, centuries, millennia."

"It's not an image. It's a new worldview," Zurbuchen said Wednesday in a news briefing.

The release will be streamed live by NASA at 10:30am EDT. In addition to the deepest infrared view yet captured of the universe, NASA officials said they will release the Webb telescope's first spectrum of an exoplanet, showing light emitted at different wavelengths from a planet in another star system. These images could offer new insights into the atmospheres and chemical makeup of other exoplanets in the cosmos.

Other images included in the inaugural release will be photos showing how galaxies interact and grow, and ones depicting the life cycle of stars, from the emergence of new ones to violent stellar deaths.

The Webb telescope will continue to beam back data in the lead-up to the July 12 event, but NASA Deputy Administrator Pam Melroy described being impressed with what she has seen so far.

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 07/12/2022 04:40 AM
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dingpatch

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Yesterday's "preview" was pretty stunning. Today's release will be OVER THE TOP.

There are various "analyses" on YouTube of the comparison between the same "galaxy cluster" area taken by the "old" Hubble image and the "New" Webb image. WOW!

The Hubble image took 2 weeks to capture. The Webb took only 12 1/2 hours. The Hubble image looks like old Super 8 compared to Webb's image quality.

What was so interesting about yesterday's reveal was when Bill Nelson described the "size" of the area covered by the image: put a grain of sand on your finger tip. Put your arm straight out and look at the grain of sand (if you can see it!). That is how small a piece of the Universe that the image covers compared to your view of everything around you!!!



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Edited: 07/12/2022 at 04:47 AM by dingpatch
 07/12/2022 09:03 AM
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3rdworldlover

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Not too shabby
For government work
 07/12/2022 12:45 PM
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dingpatch

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The gravity of the galaxy cluster bending and magnifying the light coming from distant galaxies behind the cluster, , , , , , is WOW.




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Edited: 07/12/2022 at 12:45 PM by dingpatch
 07/12/2022 05:05 PM
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LIV2SURFDT

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Precision optics is an amazing field. What is possible was once only dreamed. Beryllium is harmless in its solid form. I handle it regularly (mirrors), cleaning and prepping and performing physical vapor deposition (thin film). Safe as long as you dont chip it or God forbid shatter. Would clear the building...
 07/13/2022 06:48 AM
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dingpatch

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Back-in-the-day I purchased millions of dollars worth of beryllium every year. Mostly the HIP near-net shape for a "sensor support". It was machined at the only place in the USA that was capable, and it was "known" in the industry and had its own "stories".

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 07/14/2022 04:37 AM
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worksuxgetsponsered

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Effffffing AWESOME!

Well done to all the parties involved in making this come to fruition. One can only imagine the things we are going to learn from this achievement.



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 07/16/2022 12:39 PM
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Cole

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Fake. Drawn by the people that make Sponge Bob.

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 09/13/2022 08:57 AM
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Pagerow

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New photos from Webb of the Orion Nebula:

Text

"We are blown away by the breathtaking images of the Orion Nebula," Western University astrophysicist Els Peeters said in a statement.

"These new observations allow us to better understand how massive stars transform the gas and dust cloud in which they are born," she added.

Nebulas are obscured by large amounts of dust that made it impossible to observe with visible light telescopes, such as the Hubble Space Telescope, Webb's predecessor.
 09/13/2022 09:50 AM
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worksuxgetsponsered

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I did have a wallpaper mural that was very similar to this when I was a kid....

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Specializing in sarcasm and condescending rhetoric since 1971.
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