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Topic Title: Why Pro-life Christians should vote for Hillary Clinton
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Created On: 08/26/2016 12:16 PM
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 08/26/2016 12:16 PM
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WG

Posts: 37257
Joined Forum: 03/10/2005

"Knowing many of my pro-life friends feel torn between voting for an unpopular but highly qualified pro-choice candidate in Hillary Clinton and an incompetent narcissist who poses a unique threat to our American democracy in Donald Trump, I'd like to make a proposal:

You should vote for Hillary Clinton.

And I'd like to suggest that voting for a pro-choice candidate in this election, or any election, need not overburden your conscience.

Here's why.

In the eight years since we've had a pro-choice president, the abortion rate in the US has dropped to its lowest since 1973. I believe the best way to keep this trend going is not to simply make it harder for women to terminate unwanted pregnancies but to create a culture with fewer unwanted pregnancies to begin with.

Data suggests progressive social policies that make health care and child care more affordable, make contraception more accessible, alleviate poverty, and support a living wage do the most to create such a culture, while countries where abortion is simply illegal see no change in the abortion rate."

1) Voting pro-choice is not the same as voting for abortion
2) Criminalizing abortion won't necessarily reduce abortions
3) Pro-life advocates should support, rather than oppose, efforts to help low-income families care for their children
4) If we want to dramatically reduce the abortion rate in this country, we must support efforts to make contraception more accessible and affordable.

she spells it out in more detail@rachelheldevans.com
Rachel Held Evans is a New York Times best-selling author whose books include Faith Unraveled (2010), A Year of Biblical Womanhood (2012), and Searching for Sunday (2015). Hailing from Dayton, Tennessee - home of the famous Scopes Monkey Trial of 1925 - she writes about faith, doubt and life in the Bible Belt.


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"The truth is incontrovertible.
malice may attack it,
ignorance may deride it,
but in the end,
there it is." -Sir Winston Churchill
 08/26/2016 12:36 PM
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tpapablo

Posts: 43831
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I thought Clinton had it wrapped up. Why, in that case, are these people putting out things like this?  Granted this sort of propaganda will get exactly zero voters to change their vote, but why make the effort if the election is a done deal?



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I :heart; Q
 08/26/2016 12:37 PM
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WG

Posts: 37257
Joined Forum: 03/10/2005

taking no chances
telling it like it is

-------------------------
"The truth is incontrovertible.
malice may attack it,
ignorance may deride it,
but in the end,
there it is." -Sir Winston Churchill
 08/26/2016 07:52 PM
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RustyTruck

Posts: 33300
Joined Forum: 08/02/2004

In it to win it.

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Capitalism is based on the ridiculous notion that you can enjoy limitless growth in a closed, finite system.

In biology, such behavior of cells is called "cancer".
 08/26/2016 10:01 PM
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FloaterTwoPoint0

Posts: 27
Joined Forum: 08/25/2016

Things like what?  Things like facts?  Because it's an election.  And, people (particularly, religious right people) need to get informed before they vote.  And, because if abortions rates had dropped this dramatically during 2 consecutive Republican adminstrations, the GOP would be taking credit for the decrease and likely using silly explanations to frame the decrease like "abortions are down because we have a GOP president that supports family and moral values..."  Nonsense.  So, it's only fair to look for plausible explanations for the decrease and give credit where credit is due.

 08/27/2016 07:56 AM
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MikeTech

Posts: 148
Joined Forum: 06/12/2016

Originally posted by: tpapablo I thought Clinton had it wrapped up. Why, in that case, are these people putting out things like this?  Granted this sort of propaganda will get exactly zero voters to change their vote, but why make the effort if the election is a done deal?

 

 

It's called padding the score or running up the score. We don't want Clinton to win by single digits. Heck, even double digits in the teens would be a little bit disappointing. We want to see Trump and his supporters crushed politically.  It will help Americans understand that radical alt-right wingers are dangerous and unwanted in this country by the majority of Americans.  

 

I dont just want Trump to lose, but am hoping the process leaves him financially devastated and further despised by Republicans. 

If you guys really want your next Reagan, you couldn't have made a worse pick.  Romney would have made a much better president.  

But Romney wasn't angry and irrational enough to make it through the primaries. 

Trump is just now realizing that for Republicans you can't win the general election as a nut job. But it might be too late. He should have started shifting his positions right after the primaries.  

His nutty followers won't leave him no matter what he does. He could adopt Hillary's positions and his followers will stay.  They are programmed to never question.  

But he needed to pick up the moderates to get him to the 50% mark (or at least mid to high 40s). 

But it's too late.  He made a huge misstep in continuing the a-hole attitude in the general election.  

So you right wingers shot yourselves in the foot again. It was yours to lose and you did.  Enjoy another 4.5 years. 

 

Oh, and the senate is going left as well, along with the next few Supreme Court nominees.  

Next time, go for the moderate (like Reagan) and stop looking for the perfect psychopath.  



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See you all next summer.  Have a great rest of 2016, and don't vote for Trump.

 08/27/2016 09:15 AM
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RegularJoe

Posts: 3679
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Originally posted by: MikeTech
We don't want Clinton to win by single digits. Heck, even double digits in the teens would be a little bit disappointing. We want to see Trump and his supporters crushed politically.


What scares me about this is that Hillary may actually win by double digits, with Trump and Johnson splitting much of the anti-Clinton vote.

It could be double digits for that reason, and maybe even less voter turnout than usual, but Shrillary and supporters will incorrectly go off claiming her victory is "a mandate" from a majority of the American people.
 08/27/2016 09:36 AM
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RegularJoe

Posts: 3679
Joined Forum: 11/20/2011

Originally posted by: WG
In the eight years since we've had a pro-choice president, the abortion rate in the US has dropped to its lowest since 1973.


Just for the sake of discussion, the data tends to lag by 1-3 years, so what I gather from a few googles is that the data is probably from 2013 (5 years into Obama admin).

Despite a few minor ups and downs, the trend has been pretty consistently downward since 1980:



Another variable in the equation is this:

https://www.washingtonpost.com...3098f9e5267_story.html
The study did not examine the reasons for the drop. But the authors suggested that one factor was greater reliance on new kinds of birth control, including intra-uterine devices such as Mirena, which can last for years and are not susceptible to user error like daily pills or condoms.

They also noted the economy as a contributing factor, because people tend to adhere more strictly to their birth control during tough economic times.



https://www.guttmacher.org/new...hits-lowest-level-1973
Rather, the decline in abortions coincided with a steep national drop in overall pregnancy and birth rates. Contraceptive use improved during this period, as more women and couples were using highly effective long-acting reversible contraceptive methods, such as the IUD. Moreover, the recent recession led many women and couples to want to avoid or delay pregnancy and childbearing."


Can't say it's all roses for Hillary. Birth control good, Hillary still bad.
 08/29/2016 08:39 PM
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ww

Posts: 16088
Joined Forum: 08/17/2007

IUDs seem very important.  They were scarcely used for a long time; now, apparently with improved models, they're strongly recommended.  Guttmacher should be very knowledgeable.  

What appears to be an abrupt doubling of maternal mortality in a single year in Texas looks alarming.  Maybe they, and Florida, need Medicaid expansion.  And Planned Parenthood (they accept donations).

 08/30/2016 03:39 AM
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WG

Posts: 37257
Joined Forum: 03/10/2005

Originally posted by: RegularJoe

Originally posted by: MikeTech

We don't want Clinton to win by single digits. Heck, even double digits in the teens would be a little bit disappointing. We want to see Trump and his supporters crushed politically.




What scares me about this is that Hillary may actually win by double digits, with Trump and Johnson splitting much of the anti-Clinton vote.



It could be double digits for that reason, and maybe even less voter turnout than usual, but Shrillary and supporters will incorrectly go off claiming her victory is "a mandate" from a majority of the American people.


You meant to say correctly.
That's what we need.
A mandate for progress, against hate.

But I doubt we will see double digits
Priority one is electing her and not Donald
Still to much possibility that he could win.

(would be nice to se Johnson get double digits, the start of a real conservative party)

-------------------------
"The truth is incontrovertible.
malice may attack it,
ignorance may deride it,
but in the end,
there it is." -Sir Winston Churchill
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