http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/24/middleeast/warplane-crashes-near-syria-turkey-border/index.html

Turkish government is Syrias about their airspace!

 

Edited: 11/24/2015 at 10:13 AM by Greensleeves

workplace violence sucks

they are about to find out the difference between putin and yakov smirnoff....I would not want to be a turkey right now.....not to mention its almost thanksgiving

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I troll 2L.com to be a better person in real life

I don't think magic mike, errrrr Putin, will engage Turkey, but I bet he keeps out of their air space from now on.

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Specializing in sarcasm and condescending rhetoric since 1971.

It will be interesting to see if the PiC bungles this into WWIII.

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I :heart; Q

It was interesting to hear people saying Hillary's plan was similar to many republican plans, including the no-fly zone.

In the last Republican debate, Rand Paul said the no-fly zone was silly -- you'd have to be ready and willing to shoot down Russian jets.

And that bridge has now been crossed...

Russia violates US air and sea space all the time, even so, us shooting one down without provocation would be a completely different ball game. I'm not saying I think we should blast them every time they do it, we do the same thing. I do however think it's great that Turkey did, just to keep Vlad in check, but I hope/pray that the pilots are safely returned home though.

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Specializing in sarcasm and condescending rhetoric since 1971.

Doesn't look good on that score.

http://news.yahoo.com/turkmen-forces-syria-shot-dead-pilots-downed-russian-143818517.html

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I :heart; Q

Putin's strategy in support of Assad is proving costly.

... the word is that Anti-Assad ragheads, FSA, killed one of the two Russian pilots who ejected and took out a Russian helo coming in for SAR (using a US Stinger).

YouTube: Free Syrian Army rebels hovering over the dead body of Russian Su-24 pilot, with "allou akbars".

Wow.  FSA: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Syrian_Army#International_support

http://www.express.co.uk/news/...-searching-downed-jets

Update & correction: it was a US Tow missile that took out the Russian SAR helo. One Russian Marine KIA.

A mismatch made in defense stock heaven
Jake Novak | @jakejakeny
3 Hours Ago
CNBC.com


Sometimes it's just too easy and alluring to take advantage of an advantage.

That's what may have happened in the skies along the Turkish-Syrian border today as two Turkish F16's shot down a Russian SU-24 fighter jet. The Turks say the Russian jet was flying into Turkish airspace. The Russians deny that. The political squabbling will go on perhaps for years.

But from a military and industrial standpoint, there are things we know now that are crystal clear and they should have an impact on the bottom lines for defense contractors all over the globe.

First, I'd like to put this nicely but why mince words? A Russian SU-24 going up against an F16 is like a Pop Warner football team taking on the New England Patriots. No contest. The F16 is a far superior machine and Lockheed Martin also completed and delivered a $635 million upgrade to Turkey's F16 fleet just seven months ago. One SU-24 going up against even a non-upgraded F16 is still a mismatch. But an SU-24 going up against two upgraded F16's is a laugher. Is it possible this incident was the product of Turkish pilots who were just unable to resist their huge advantage in the skies? Someone will have to ask them.

But the advantages and mismatches won't stop there. Because the established worldwide defense industry is already finding the continuing Syrian civil war and the war on ISIS to be a bonanza for its business. It was one thing when the worldwide war against terrorism was simply against the terrorists. As scary as they can be, ISIS, al Qaeda, Hamas, Boko Haram, Hezbollah etc. don't use the most sophisticated weapons and they certainly don't have fighter jets, and that includes outdated ones like the SU-24. The most frightening thing these groups do often use are ground-to-ground missiles like Hamas and its offshoots use against Israel. That created the need for the impressive "Iron Dome" missile defense system that the Israeli and American designers have already begun to successfully sell to some of their allies.

But with the Russians now getting into the mix in Syria with air and ground power, the weapons and deterrence wish list is growing for countries involved directly and indirectly in the Syrian fighting. The headlines have been hard to miss. It seems like every country from Britain to Japan is beefing up defense budgets and looking to acquire the best weapons and surveillance equipment available. No other Middle Eastern nation wants the Syrian war to bleed into its borders. That's one reason why Syria's neighbors have accepted so few Syrian refugees. Perhaps they're worried they will suffer the same fate Lebanon did in the 1970's after a massive amount of refugees flooded its border fleeing Jordan's "Black September" purge.

The other big market maker in this space is Iran. The nuclear deal with the mullahs pushed by President Obama and signed by the Western powers has Israel and Iran's Arab neighbors in a very acquisitive mood. The Israelis have recently forged an agreement with Lockheed to buy several F35 fighters the Israelis have re-designed to double their radar-defeating stealth range. The Saudis began a massive arms build up last year not only for their own defense, but they also are acting as lending bank to nations like Egypt, Jordan and the UAE so they can buy more weapons too. The funny thing is many of those Saudi-funded arms deals are for Russian weapons, which just goes to show how mixed up and maybe even desperate this situation is.

The bottom line is the stocks of the major defense contractors like Lockheed, Boeing, Northrop Grumman, and Raytheon are all outperforming the overall market for this year. And while we may not see a major upside move in the next few days, it's hard to believe this shoot down incident isn't a bullish sign for the defense sector for the coming year and beyond.

Commentary by Jake Novak, supervising producer of "Power Lunch." Follow him on Twitter @jakejakeny.

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Dora Hates You

Wow that guy has a way with words, as in way too many! Did it really take 8 paragraphs to sum up what has been discussed at large in the past 6 months. Glad you could at least sum it up for us in your own words dingbat....bob3000 ever give some one a -1/5?

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I troll 2L.com to be a better person in real life

'Sloppy' Russia Got 10 Warnings Before Turkish Shootdown, Says Defense Dept.
BY BRIDGET JOHNSON NOVEMBER 24, 2015 CHAT 27 COMMENTS

The spokesman for the coalition fighting ISIS in Iraq and Syria confirmed to reporters at the Pentagon this morning that Turkey gave 10 warnings to Russian fighters before one was shot down over the Syrian border region today.

Col. Steve Warren, the spokesman in Iraq for Operation Inherent Resolve, also said Russia greatly "exaggerated" its claims last week to have destroyed 500 ISIS oil tankers with airstrikes.

Warren, stressing that the shootdown "is not an issue that involves Operation Inherent Resolve," confirmed two Turkish F-16s on border patrol "engaged" two Russian Su-24s. One Russian aircraft was shot down.

The crew reportedly ejected before the crash in Latakia province; the Defense Department couldn't confirm reports that one of the pilots was dead.

"This goes beyond the normal struggle against terrorism. This was a stab in the back by the accomplices of terrorists," Russian President Vladimir Putin said. "Our pilots and our plane did not in any way threaten Turkey. It is quite clear."

Putin said the planes "were carrying out an operation against [Islamic State militants] in the mountains of northern Latakia, where militants who originate from Russian territory are concentrated. So they were carrying the key task of preventative attacks against those who could return to Russia at any time."

Warren said today, though, that the Russians are still not focused on taking out ISIS. "Only a fraction of their attacks have been against ISIL targets," he said. "There are no ISIL targets in the area where this happened, anyway."

The colonel said Russia is conducting "sloppy military work," with a "reckless, irresponsible, uncaring approach." He added there's "upwards of a thousand civilian casualties caused by the Russians," including "over 100 kids."

Warren said of the Turkey shootdown, "There were no U.S. personnel in the vicinity of this incident, so we did not observe it."

"This was purely an action that took place between the Russians and the Turks," he said, noting that "certainly we have radar and other acquisition capabilities in place ... we're still gathering the facts and looking at all the details."

"The incident happened at the border, that much I can tell you."

Warren stressed that "all aircraft should respect the sovereignty of nations around them."

"The international protocol and standards and norms are well established," he said. "There's no reason for aircraft to be flying where they shouldn't."

Asked what could have been done to stop the Russian planes instead of firing, Warren said there's a "whole range" of intercepting options including escorting -- but "it's really a matter for the Turks to talk about."

Turkey said in a letter to the UN Security Council today that the Russian aircraft were warned 10 times in a span of five minutes, with no response. They said Turkish airspace was violated for 17 seconds, with one Russian plane leaving and the other fired at "in accordance with the rules of engagement."

Last week, Russia released video it said showed their airstrikes to destroy 500 ISIS oil tankers. Warren said there's no way the operation could have happened as the Kremlin claimed.

"The battle damage assessment they issued seemed to be exaggerated," Warren said, estimating Russian hit "under 100" tankers.

"We didn't go through the effort to count, to do a detailed battle assessment," he said, elaborating that Defense officials studied the video. "Unless the Russians are counting flattened tires and chipped paint," Warren added, it's "impossible" -- especially using the "dumb bombs, old-fashioned mid-20th century technology and accuracy to sling lead around the battlefield" as Russia does.

Russia has "routinely demonstrated now that their goal is to prop up and prolong the Assad regime," the Inherent Resolve spokesman stressed, conducting strikes that are a "direct benefit" to the Assad regime.

"It's notable that Russia struck trucks only after we met with such stunning success, and I guess the Russians felt they had to get in on that," Warren said.

As far as coalition efforts, Warren said "we're seeing the impacts of our operations to defeat ISIL." He showed video of Nov. 22 strikes near Al-Hasakah and Deir Ezzor that took out 283 oil tanker trucks. "As we did on the first tanker truck strike we did a leaflet drop ahead of time to warn civilian tanker drivers to leave the area."

He also showed video of a precision strike on a bridge near Ramadi to protect Iraqi forces from car bomb attacks -- the vehicle-borne improvised explosive devices that are "an ISIL weapon of choice." Targeted strikes are also focused on VBIED factories.

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Dora Hates You

Vladdy bit off way more than he can chew over there. He won't do anything to the Turks. As tpap would say, he a PiC too.

Looks like Turkey is back on the menu, boys! - Putin

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Water dissolving...and water removing
There is water at the bottom of the ocean


Edited: 11/25/2015 at 06:33 AM by bob3000

Putin is going to put his feet on the Ottoman!!  (empire... that is)

 

Probably some economic dealio... Yes?

Turkey is a member of NATO. Putin knows what that means.

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“It is the heart of US policy to use fascism to preserve capitalism while claiming to be saving democracy from communism “ - Michael Parenti

Unfortunately, he isn't. He's appears to be a Russian Napolean who has shown his willingness to take advantage of the PiC's weakness. History has repeatedly shown that weakness invites conflict. The PiC obviously had not learned that lesson. Now we have a royal mess thanks to that cretin.

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I :heart; Q