The stickiest question about ethanol is this: Does making alcohol from grain or plant waste really create any new energy?

![]() |
2nd Light Forums | ![]() |
|
join :
help :
calendar :
home
|
||
|
Latest News:
|
latest topics : statistics | |


|
Topic Title: food Topic Summary: is the biggest threat to world security Created On: 04/04/2012 08:18 AM Status: Post and Reply |
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch |
Topic Tools
|
|
|
|
|
"Grain yields are beginning to hit a "glass ceiling" in many countries, Brown said, where farmers have already taken advantage of what science has to offer for improving yield. As more and more countries hit an upper limit on productivity, the world grain harvest will begin to plateau, even as demand for food continues to rise, causing a rise in prices. More worrisome, the global food market is vulnerable to external shocks such as prolonged drought. "We don't have idle land, we're flat out," says Brown. "We don't have [food] stocks. We're living harvest to harvest. The question becomes, what if we have a major shortfall in the world?"
An extreme weather event could tip the scales, he says. For instance, the heat wave and drought in Russia in 2010 reduced the country's grain harvest by 40 percent, which tightened world supplies. If such a heat wave in the American Midwest were to have a similar impact on the much larger U.S. harvest, "we would have chaos on world grain markets," says Brown. "That would affect financial markets, and financial stability in the world, which rests on confidence." SciAm |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Peak grain.
------------------------- Learn something. Anything. Please. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poor farmers. They grow and give so we can survive. We tell them how much we'll pay for their goods. They stay poor no matter what their yeild. Maybe the 'world market' could get a taste for the life of a farmer? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
So let's keep turning one of our main food sources into shitty fuel! The stickiest question about ethanol is this: Does making alcohol from grain or plant waste really create any new energy? The answer, of course, depends upon whom you ask. The ethanol lobby claims there's a 30 percent net gain in BTUs from ethanol made from corn. Other boosters, including Woolsey, claim there are huge energy gains (as much as 700 percent) to be had by making ethanol from grass. But the ethanol critics have shown that the industry calculations are bogus. David Pimentel, a professor of ecology at Cornell University who has been studying grain alcohol for 20 years, and Tad Patzek, an engineering professor at the University of California, Berkeley, co-wrote a recent report that estimates that making ethanol from corn requires 29 percent more fossil energy than the ethanol fuel itself actually contains. The two scientists calculated all the fuel inputs for ethanol production—from the diesel fuel for the tractor planting the corn, to the fertilizer put in the field, to the energy needed at the processing plant—and found that ethanol is a net energy-loser. According to their calculations, ethanol contains about 76,000 BTUs per gallon, but producing that ethanol from corn takes about 98,000 BTUs. For comparison, a gallon of gasoline contains about 116,000 BTUs per gallon. But making that gallon of gas—from drilling the well, to transportation, through refining—requires around 22,000 BTUs. -------------------------
"The problems we face today exist because the People who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for their living." |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't think anyone likes ethanol. It's low-yield solar.
Actually, that brings up the interesting point of how complex and expensive it is to make something we can eat. Fortunately, humans don't need that much energy to keep their bods going...unlike a car. "Making that gallon of gas"...bad terminology. Harvesting ancient solar more like. I.e., not sustainable. ------------------------- Learn something. Anything. Please. Edited: 04/04/2012 at 09:00 AM by TheLetterTBird |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poor farmer?
Where? I suppose if you're referring to the few and far between family owned and operated farms, maybe. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nothing fundamentally wrong with ethanol as a biofuel.
Just dumb to make it from fossil fuel grown corn, at a net energy loss. This was all farm state politics, tax expenditures. Wouldn't exist any more if all those tiny population farming red states weren't so over-represented in the congress. Isn't ethanol cost effective in Brazil? They use sugar cane and reprocess the waste mass for energy. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I need food...y'all have fun!
------------------------- ..on the slops we didnt think about coler.~Shifty |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Floriduh is about to become a huge ethanol farm.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I read recently (don't have exact figures handy) that US food prices in the last decade or so were up about 130%, and that biofuels were responsible for about 70% of that.
Will update if I find the reference and exact numbers again. ------------------------- That boy's got somethin' wrong with his medulla oblongata. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
------------------------- And Bob will ALWAYS be my numero uno. -Tiffanys |
|
|
|
|
|
2nd Light Forums
» N S R
»
food
|
Topic Tools |
FuseTalk Basic Edition v3.2 - © 1999-2013 FuseTalk Inc. All rights reserved.
dust.resin.water...... Get your copy from http://dustresinwater.com/